Lap joint on end of 2x4?

[Mike Paulsen]

(snip)

SuperWoodworker might double up 1x4s rather than cutting lap joints in

2x4s, depending on the application.

[Winston]

Great idea but 2 x 4 was the smallest PT lumber I could find.

As dpb says, grain orientation would prevent the joint from being structurally sound anyway, so perhaps a steel frame or maybe some "L" StrongTie joints.

for helping the noob, guys.

--Winston

[dadiOH]

Just adjust them so the centers (hub) are touching. You may have to rotate them so teeth of one are next to the gullets of the other, maybe not.

[dadiOH]

None that I have ever cut was.

[dadiOH]

Butting in, any glue will glue but some glue better. PVA (white glue) is no good around water. Aliphatic ("yellow glue") may or not be OK...type one isn't good around water; type 2 is "water resisant" which should be fine; type 3 is waterproof.

Also water proof are epoxy, Resorcinol, and urea-formaldehyde glues such as Weldwood Plastic Resin. All are overkill for your project IMO.

Epoxy is good for joining less than good joints when it is thickened with something like Cab-o-Sil.

[dadiOH]

Over 40 years, I have made hundreds of them. None have ever failed whether inside or outside.

[dadiOH]

1. Douglas fir isn't weak. Certainly, there are others stronger but not softwoods AFAIK. You are lucky to live where you can get it easily and (I trust) inexpensively.
2. If the mating surfaces are reasonably flat your joints will be fine with or without the screws. Screws are handy to clamp them together while the glue dries though and won't hurt anything.

The biggest problem with screws is that it is next to impossible to find convenient sources of hot dipped galvanized screws. Outdoors, plain steel or electro-plated steel will rust; given time (months to years) the rusted areas will eventually deteriorate the wood. Bronze, stainless steel and Monel don't rust. ____________

Not really. What is complicated is the differing opinions. The best opinions are based on experience.

[Puckdropper]

Larry Jaques wrote in news: [e-mail]:

*snip*

Ever heard of the Omni Dual Saw? Same idea... except I don't know if they'd ever tried it going backwards.

"Our saw cuts so well backwards, just imagine what it could do forwards!"

:-)

Puckdroper

[Winston]

Soon as the rain lets up I'll head to the hardware store and pick up a couple blades.

This should be good. :)

--Winston

[Winston]

(...)

I am So ConFused!

--Winston

[Puckdropper]

"dadiOH" wrote in news:tPDBn.139149$ [e-mail]:

*snip*

Would that happen to be why the various Titebonds are named the way they are?

Puckdropper

[Winston]

I will ask for 'type 3 aliphatic glue', yes?

--Winston

[dadiOH]

sizeable, roughly 4' x 6'. It is 12 years old now, joints are fine. Just glued, no screws; not sure what glue I used but most likely Type 2 yellow.

I don't recall what you are making, gate? If so and it is sizeable and heavy your biggest potential problem is sag (2x4s aren't all that strong). A diagonal from the top outside corner to the bottom inside (hinge side) corner will help counter that. Ditto steel straps. See photo here...

it's a gate and you intend to attach boards to the frame, leave at least

1/8" between the boards; i.e., don't try to fit them together to make a solid wood surface. Reason is they will expand and contract and if they are chock-o-block one to another there is no room to expand.

[Winston]

It does require careful sorting to find lumber that is halfway clear and free of bark and chips, though.

Heh! The Home Depot lumber guy apparently didn't like me 'cherry picking' his pile of 2 x 4's very much. (I put back my rejects neatly so I don't understand his attitude.)

I looked up after loading my cart and saw that he had closed the gates on both ends of the aisle, caging me in. He re-appeared and asked if I wanted out, so I told him 'Yes, unless you want to buy me lunch'!. :)

OK.

On recommendation from the sales guy, I bought a couple boxes of 'Primeguard Plus' square / phillips drive screws. They are said to be good for outdoor use and to be compatible with the chems in pressure treated lumber. I hope they will be OK, because they drive like a dream, even into dry wood.

(...)

I will go with Plan 'A' (lap frame corners, glued and screwed).

I've been really lucky with the rest of the fence so perhaps this will work, too.

Thanks!

--Winston

[Swingman]

Take this to the bank: use a "construction adhesive" that is formulated for pressure treated wood.

One that immediately comes to mind, and should be easy to find at the BORG, is "Liquid Nails - Subfloor".

Simply put, disregard anything else you read on this issue in this thread about gluing with other types of woodworking glues ...

[dadiOH]

That or type 2. Not likely a clerk will know what you want if you ask for aliphatic glue though. The "type" thing is (I think) what Titebond calls them, get it or just read the label on other brands.

[whit3rd]

[on making a half-lap joint on board ends]

YES! This is the least energy approach, works with the wood grain to produce the desired shape with simple saw cuts and very quick chisel work. A plane or rabbet plane would easily clean up the split face, if that's not acceptable straight from the chisel.

The cut or cuts are shallow, and a thin kerf blade is appropriate. Gang the boards together and make a Skilsaw (handheld circular saw) kerf on a half dozen at a time. When those are all done, remove the dust mask. True neanders will have a miter saw with depth stops, in handheld back saw style. That will work, too.

[J. Clarke]

I'm curious. You say "the first 1/4" or so is _brown_". Are you talking about "brown treated lumber"? If so that 1/4" of brown is a colorant, not the preservative. It's applied in a separate operation, not under pressure.

[J. Clarke]

Don't trust either of us. Go down to Home Depot, get a green pressure treated 4x4, cut it in half, see what the inside looks like.

[Winston]

I have the PT 2 x 4 s and am sketching up the gate. I am sure it will turn out fine and I thank you guys for your thoughts.

--Winston