finishing disaster.

Started finishing a desk set. Maple sanded to 220. No pre=stain (ie seal coat) Finish Barley Chestnut gel stain.

Blotchy... ahhhhhhhhhh!!!!!

fortunately its only the first piece of the set. Was hoping to avoid doing all the pieces with seal coat. I was looking for a darker color and sanding sealer means a longer buildup

Oh well, I'll start the sealing process.

I have only been lucky once or twice with gel and blotchy wood.

Reply to
woodchucker
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And, IIRC gel stains, at least one brand, were advertised as non- blotchy. I was the go-to finishing guy at the Woodcraft I worked at several years ago. When the gels came out, I tried one without sealer so I could respond to questions about it. Took the result in to the boss and told him the non-blotchy claim was a lie.

But they're still nice for vertical surfaces.

Reply to
Larry Blanchard

Did you work for Woodcraft in 1989? I started using Bartley's gel stains in 1989.

Reply to
Leon

I think it was more like 2004 or 5. The gel stains I was referring to were General. I worked part-time for 3 years so it would have been somewhere between 2003-2006.

Reply to
Larry Blanchard

Yes that period sounds correct. I was unimpressed by General Gel finishes and especially the gel varnish. Although I have used the General Finishes stains lately and had better luck, but it took me getting to my second quart to figure out how to apply with out getting blotches even on easy woods like oak.

I started using gel stains and varnishes back in 1989 with Bartleys. A superior product back then. Bartley's has changed hands 2~3 times since then. When Bartley's furniture sold off the finishes line Lawrence McFadden bought it. I'm not sure if Bartley's finishes continued to be as good but I immediately switched to Lawrence Mcfadden.

LMF, Lawrence McFadden did not have a good sample of a color for the Bartley's line that they just bought. Long story shore, we made a swap, I sent them a pint of my stain color that they wanted, and it was half gone, in exchange for 2 quarts of their LMF products. That is all it took and I was hooked on LMF. Clearly better and easier to work with than Bartley's and I thought Bartley's was very easy.

Both products could be wiped on and off in a relatively short period of time. Then LMF went out of business and sold their product lines to Seabourn finishes. They did not want to deal with me directly so I looked for a replacement.

I tried General finishes Java Gel 5 years ago and it was terrible. Wipe it on and when you get back around to your starting point on the face frame it thinned out and became blotchy. The stain actually wiped off and almost disappeared.

From there I switched to Old Masters gel varnishes and finally read the instructions after about 4 quarts and have had great results since. Unlike LMF and Bartelys products you wipe Old Masters varnish on and IMMEDIATELY wipe it off and IMMEDIATELY lightly buff it out with another clean rag. I apply, wipe off, and buff out with the Blue Scotts shop paper towels. If you feel any drag while wiping off you have either covered too big of an area or waited too long past IMMEDIATELY to wipe it off. My problem was the buffing which I originally was neglecting to do. The finish stayed tacky for 24+ hours. The simple IMMEDIATE slight buffing meant the possibility of 3 coats a day if you start early enough and the temp and humidity is not an extreme.

I finally learned with General Finishes gel stains to IMMEDIATELY wipe the stain off. The longer you wait the tackier and harder it is to remove the excess. AND immediately wiping it down seems to set the stain so that coming around the face frame to the beginning point did not present adverse effects.

The lesson I have learned, you cannot get the product off of the wood too fast. The faster you wipe it off the easier it comes off and the less it removes the previous coated starting point.

Whew!

Reply to
Leon

Interesting. I wonder if Bartley's will work the same. my history with gel is leave it on longer because it doesn't seem to build. once it seals. Seagraves is a well known finishing company. Maple is tough because there's not a lot of tooth to hold onto stain.

Reply to
woodchucker

It was my understanding that sanding prep for gel stain should be no finer than 150 grit.

From

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"When using oil stains on raw wood, prep sand with 120 grit sandpaper followed by 150 grit. Don't go any finer with the sanding grit or else the wood won't hold color."

I'm pretty sure the Zar gel stain I used said the same thing on the can.

I recently used Zar gel stain on a bunch of quarter-sawn Douglas fir. The test pieces without sealer were terrible. The sealer evened it all out. I used 2 coats of sealer on the end grain with a very light application of stain to keep the end grain from becoming way too dark. A little contrast is OK, but the extra coat of sealer kept the stain color within an acceptable range.

While 99.9% was sanded to 150, I did burnish the end grain with 220 to prevent absorption.

Reply to
DerbyDad03

So my finishing took a turn for the better.

A) I started using zinsser sanding sealer.. yesterday. Tonight, I started staining the drawer fronts (rail and stile) NO BLOTCHING.

B) I read the can like Leon said, I was applying this all wrong. wipe it off immediately and buff, it says it will build. I had followed instructions from another product, that I watched a u-tube on and that was not good for Bartley's. Yes its light, and if it builds great. If not... well ... if I get there I'll figure that out. But for now, shellac saves the day like usual.. And thanks Leon.

Reply to
woodchucker

I love Leon's advice. I love Zinsser. I love shellac.

Those are three things which you can't go wrong.

Reply to
-MIKE-

LOL... I HATE it when you have to read the fine print on the can. ;~)

Reply to
Leon

Except when I am wrong. It happens to all of us. :~)

Reply to
Leon

I thought I was wrong once. But I was mistaken. :-D

Reply to
-MIKE-

Uh HUH.. me2 LOL

Reply to
Leon

Yea, verily!

Reply to
Larry Blanchard

DeMille reincarnated?

Reply to
Larry Blanchard

Especially as they keep making it smaller every year!

Reply to
Larry Blanchard

Leon wrote in news: snipped-for-privacy@giganews.com:

I thought so too, but it turns out that I was right and the universe was wrong! (I can give examples. :-))

Puckdropper

Reply to
Puckdropper

LOL You caught that.

Reply to
Leon

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