xrongor states:
Randy, that's marketing, not lying. There's a difference. Or so the marketing department will tell you.
Charlie Self "It is even harder for the average ape to believe that he has descended from man." H. L. Mencken
Do you mean, that it's like airbags - the safety system works ONCE, and something has to be replaced afterwards for $75. Sheesh!
Sounds like someone trying to prove a negative assuption. Compare this to
Can't be done. It's hard to prove a negative assertion. That's why people are arguing the opposite.
Assertion: Sawstop is a real product. Proof: Find one case where someone bought it and owns it.
If it's been 4 years, and one has not been sold, then there is some design issue that has not been solved. Heck, they could buy a COTS saw, add the device, and re-sell it. Where is it?
I suspect one of the issues is making sure the legal claims are accurate. Lawyers tend to be pessimistic about things like that.
Let's see - false positive - it stops when you don't want it to. False negative - it doesn't stop, and amputates a finger/hand. At least one of these is causing a problem. Or as someone suggested, each "stop" costs money to replace something. The FAQ says the arbor is disengaged. This doesn't sound like a "single-use" mechanism. I'd love to learn more about this...
The web site says you can "pre-order" one today.
Classic definition of vaporware right there. Kind of like Doom 3, but there's a release date for that now, maybe-ish.
Yep. They'll take preorders for the replacement modules as well. Also, you need to change the module if you use an 8" or 6" dado (different module for each). Presumably one of the features of their saw is some way to detect an undersized blade and not run if the incorrect module is installed. Or maybe working that out is one of the reasons they haven't shipped a product yet.
Thinking about this a bit, I wonder how it would handle the planer and shaper attachments often used on radial arm saws? The planer doesn't have anything for their pin to catch in and it wouldn't surprise me if trying to stop the shaper by shoving a pin in the way of the blades caused it to throw a knife.
Go to and move the mouse pointer over "cartridge system" and you'll find their statement that "The system's brake is housed in a cartridge that is easily replaced should the system ever be triggered. These replaceable cartridges enable the system to be quickly adapted for use with different sizes and types of saw blades. " I believe that the disengaging arbor is intended to avoid damaging the motor. Now though I'm wondering about this worm gear they mention. I'm having trouble visualizing how that works and they don't show the mechanism clearly enough in their pictures for me to be able to figure it out.
Nobody said it doesn't work; in fact, the consensus of Da Wreck's previous discussions of SawStop is that it *does* work, and is pretty damn impressive besides.
Nobody said it doesn't exist, either. However, it *is* a fact that this machine is not yet (or is only *very* recently) in actual production.
Excuse me -- you *did* claim *exactly* that: "for every fool that thinks they are invincible and may get hurt due to lack of respect, there are others (more people) that didnt get their hand cut off because the sawstop worked"
-- Regards, Doug Miller (alphageek-at-milmac-dot-com)
Get a copy of my NEW AND IMPROVED TrollFilter for NewsProxy/Nfilter by sending email to autoresponder at filterinfo-at-milmac-dot-com You must use your REAL email address to get a response.
That page has said "now available" for about two years now. And they still aren't available.
-- Regards, Doug Miller (alphageek-at-milmac-dot-com)
Get a copy of my NEW AND IMPROVED TrollFilter for NewsProxy/Nfilter by sending email to autoresponder at filterinfo-at-milmac-dot-com You must use your REAL email address to get a response.
No rumor. SawStop filed a petition with the Consumer Product Safety Commission requesting that automatic-stop technology be required on all table saws. It's been cussed and discussed to death on this ng at least twice in the last year or so. DAGS and you'll see what I mean.
-- Regards, Doug Miller (alphageek-at-milmac-dot-com)
Get a copy of my NEW AND IMPROVED TrollFilter for NewsProxy/Nfilter by sending email to autoresponder at filterinfo-at-milmac-dot-com You must use your REAL email address to get a response.
Bruce Barnett asks:
Ayup. And they say $150 up front cost (if installed on the assembly line) and a $75 cartridge replacement cost, but say nothing of the strain on the arbor and trunnions when the assembly instantly drops below the table and is jammed to a stop.
Charlie Self "It is even harder for the average ape to believe that he has descended from man." H. L. Mencken
On Wed, 30 Jun 2004 23:04:10 GMT, Lobby Dosser vaguely proposed a theory ......and in reply I say!:
remove ns from my header address to reply via email
The sawstop will work when no power is applied to the MOTOR. If you change blades with power applied to SAW the you deserve what you get.
On Thu, 01 Jul 2004 16:12:29 -0400, "J. Clarke" vaguely proposed a theory ......and in reply I say!:
remove ns from my header address to reply via email
Ya nearly had me til there....
and you are only posting the part of the discussion you need to make yourself correct. let me put the whole thing back in context without some creative snipping. you're the second person to take the word NO off the front which makes what i said into a blind statement not the answer to someones specific question.:
(start here) (the question i was responding to was:)
no. for every fool that thinks they are invincible and may get hurt due to lack of respect, there are others (more people) that didnt get their hand cut off because the sawstop worked. in fact in many cases it would probably even save the fool.
not to mention anyone who thinks the safety device is a substitute for thinking is gonna get hurt no matter what eventually...
(stop here)
i was speaking in context of answering that question. i think all but the most hardheaded can see clearly that i wasnt actually claiming any hands cut off or not cut. just making a comment on whether or not safety devices cause accidents by making people complacent.
now step off please.
randy
statistically
ya i know its been discussed here to death.... but that doesnt mean everything said here is true. there are clearly some people in this group that seem to be against sawstop to the point of hatred. and the key to what i said before is 'trying hard'. for all i know they filed a petition two years ago, it died, and so did that idea. i wouldnt call that trying hard. or maybe they have hostages and intend on making it happen tomorrow. now that would be trying!
randy
now YOU know how it feels when someone takes what you said and twists it to come to the stupidest possible conclusion...
randy
ya thats pretty tricky how they do that
randy
touch lamps don't work 100% of the time when touched. If THAT'S the SawStop's technology, NO THANK YOU!
dave
No, it's not clear at all _what_ you intended. Try "No. For every fool who thinks he is invincible and may get hurt due to lack of respect there would be others that didn't get their hand cut off because the sawstop worked."
Think about what you're saying here. IF it works, I'm wondering if I ran my fingers into the blade and it snapped my arbor and trunnions - destroyed my saw - but didn't leave me fingerless, would I feel I'd rather have lost my fingers (or arm or...) than the saw? I don't know of any piece of machinery anywhere that I'd trade for any body part.
Keith
HomeOwnersHub website is not affiliated with any of the manufacturers or service providers discussed here. All logos and trade names are the property of their respective owners.