Which knot?

Ain't that the truth.

And this is supposed to be a 'companion animal'? Sounds like it would be better off living on it's own somewhere?

And if that was most other (and not even 'companion) animals, they would just move away or possibly yelp (if a dog) etc. They would be very unlikely to bite or scratch for such things.

I think cats are just pompous, arrogant and pointless. ;-)

When daughter was up the RSPCA place the other day they were 'petting' the pigs [1], horses and goats and none of them bit her because they had had enough attention (I'm not saying they couldn't, just that they didn't, even though they were all much bigger than a cat).

Cheers, T i m

Maybe that's their response to you. I don't normally get that.

I didn't say that. Their moods just change much faster than humans, you always need to pay attention with cats.

yes

Few people will handle big cats. But some can.

Pay attention is the key mantra with cats. Cats pay much more attention to things than people, and expect us to do likewise. Fail to and people don't get along so well with them.

They're gentle when they bite/scratch, unless you really piss them off. It's almost always in response to people failing to pay attention.

NT

Your loss I guess

I can't say I 'normally' get that but just often enough to know that cats aren't what I would consider to be a good 'companion animal.

You said much of that?

"Cats are famous for their emotional state varying all over the place quickly." .... which of course is very likely to make them 'very 'touchy', temperamental and unpredictable'.

I wasn't comparing them with humans but most other 'companion animals'.

I could see how that might be acceptable advice if you were playing with a tarantula or venomous snake, but they aren't really 'cuddly pets' you would typically have loose in your house are they?

;-)

By 'big cats' do you mean 'large domestic type cats' or actual 'big cats'?

Ok.

No, 'don't have them as 'companion animals' I think is more appropriate ... well, unless you give on your own on a farm with 50 of them etc.

But why do you consider that acceptable ... unless you are willing to parallel keeping cats along with keeping snakes or tarantula?

Oh I'm sure they are (considering etc), just that it's not something anyone should have to put up with from a 'companion animal'. Now if it was wild and you just threw it some food now and again I would understand it all.

Now if that were a dog and it happened to do the same when actually harassed by a child (poking it's fingers in it's eyes, or climbing on it etc) then there would be cries to have the animal destroyed because it would be considered 'unpredictable' or 'untrustworthy' etc?

A cat does it just because you haven't realised it only wanted you stroking it for five minutes not six, and that's considered perfectly reasonable ? ;-)

Maybe the next time one jumps onto my lap I'll wait till it goes to sleep then throw it off because *I* have just decided I've had enough?

Now't as strange as folk!

Cheers, T i m

What, for them not bringing the pig home? If it were that or a cat ... you would have been right. ;-)

But if you *are* talking about cats, you are very wrong mate and that's something I've *learned* over 61 years now.

Ok, I could keep snakes, piranha, or a monitor lizard but I would be considered 'reckless' if I let anyone near them (or them near any of them, like keeping piranha in my swimming pool), without suitable training, warning or protective equipment.

But apart from not wanting any of the above because of the risk to others, I wouldn't consider any of them a true 'companion animal' as I would say (typically) a dog (probably the ultimate of such). Even a pot-bellied-pig, lama, goat or horse could become a 'good companion', especially if hand reared etc but again, it's not so easy to take your companion lama on the train or share the sofa with a horse.

But at least none of those are likely to just attack (bite / scratch) their 'companion' human, or their humans friend, simply for stroking them 60 seconds too long. ;-(

And yes, I know horses can bite and pigs can be very protective of their young but again, they don't generally just 'lash out' for no good reason, good reason by 'our' standards of 'a friend / companion'.

I don't hate cats, I just don't think they serve any purpose, outside maybe catching mice on a farm (and wild birds and voles etc). It's the very arrogance you seem to cite and accept from them that convinces me they aren't for me (or many people looking for a true companion animal').

Ok, if you can't have a dog, have something else but if you really want a *dog*, a cat isn't a substitute (AIMHO of course). ;-)

Cheers, T i m

p.s. If you really are a 'car whisperer' there is a very good chance you could get your own TV show and earn a fortune from the 'carers' of many cats who would like come say in the matter. ;-)

so that's often their response to you. It's not their response to me.

thank you for confirming I didn't say what you said I did

do you have a point?

irrelevant

I mean big cats.

Yet tens of millions of people in the uk get along just fine with domestic cats. Do you have any other stupid points to make?

I accept that you have no idea

I accept that you don't understand it all

not from me, but I'm aware that some people think all animals should have unlimited tolerance of abuse from humans.

Very true

NT

it's good that you relate to dogs. And childish to criticise people that relate to cats.

They're smart enough to have worked out how to have a good life without working for us. They still do bring immense benefits, as just one example it's no coincidence that kiddy gangsters have pretty much always failed to bond with cats as kids.

what a silly point

I don't see how.

NT

It's their response to many people, often including their 'owners'.

That's why I didn't put my first reference in direct quotes ... I was talking of the spirit of what you said that still stands.

Now you have said that no (depending on how you read your previous comment).

Not if they are *supposed* to be a 'companion animals' it isn't, it's the whole point!

Ok. So, did you have a point? I'm not sure how often you get a stray lion in England (and if you did they would probably get a marksman to shoot it, not send out the local animal roundup folk!

My point was, even though daughter has had to recover some fairly big and often abused dogs, she hasn't (so far anyway) has the same reaction from them as she has from stroking a similar number of cats.

Yes, it sounds like 'getting along' is the best that most can hope for ... not the ideal relationship for / with a 'companion animal' though eh?

Sorry if I touched a nerve or confused you mate. ;-(

No, I have every idea, I *understand* that many people who 'have cats' really just provide bed and breakfast for them and aren't looking for a true 'companion animal'. Many people who do this don't care that

How often do you 'go out' with your cat, go on holiday with your cat, go on long walks with your cat, take your cat down the pub or on the train or ferry etc? How much of a 'companion' is it when you are doing those things? I'm not saying that you have to take your pet to such places, just that if you have a cat or parrot you probably wouldn't want to.

Like I said, I understand it all, it is you who is confused what 'a Pet' actually means. But hey, don't take my word for it, read Wikipedia:

"A pet or companion animal is an animal kept primarily for a person's company, protection, or entertainment ..."

Ok, how about this, if you don't call a cat 'a pet' in the same way say a dog would be to most, I'll leave you to your relationship with your semi wild animal.

Quite, but my point wasn't about abusing anything, it was about the animals reaction, even when being petted (and you have confirmed this to be the truth).

Except, much as though I would like to, I wouldn't, unless it took it too far first. The point was that I really shouldn't need to should I?

When we took the rabbit to the vets last night there were two other animals there. A puppy pit bull thing that was just on a lead and as soppy as anything (it loved having it's back scratched and for as long as I continued doing it) ... our rabbit, out in daughters arms and just watching what was going on (then went to sleep as she stroked it) and a cat-in-a-box that probably couldn't be let out as it might run away and they would never get it back? I wonder how it might react if I went up and stroked it? What odds would you put on the outcome?

Cheers, T i m

I wonder though. I wonder what percentage of them only have a cat because ...

They aren't around enough to properly care for a dog (but can still care for a cat?).

They live somewhere where dogs aren't allowed (but can get away with a cat because the things are roaming about everywhere anyway).

They don't *want* the responsibility of dog ownership. The cost of getting them chipped and the general upkeep etc? A cat is a cheap / lazy alternative?

FWIW, more people have dogs than cats in the UK and that's even with all the above taken into consideration (and more people having more cats than dogs).

And equally childish to suggest someone can't or doesn't relate to cats? For me it's a completely practical and real world understanding of the pros and cons of dogs versus pretty well anything else.

Nice copout.

Oh, I'm sure they do, if you don't want the depth of companionship you get from a dog.

Or bond with any animal possibly? That's all down to EQ and opportunity.

Whilst they may be considered so by their 'owners', they aren't in comparison with the depth of real companionship you can get from a dog. Of course, like all living creatures the characters can very and so not all dogs are the same, just as not all cats are. However, the fundamentals are that you can (fact) do and share more stuff ITRW than you can a cat (or budgie or hamster etc).

Yes, remember, I'm the one who does know the difference and has

It's a perfectly good a valid point to anyone who has actually had a good dog as a companion.

Well, all you need to do is send a short video of you turning a completely out_of_control cat into a good, reliable and predictable 'companion animal' in a few hours and you will have cracked it. You can do that can't you?

Or will it just be a video of you trying to herd cats? ;-)

So, rather than just repeating why you think I'm wrong and don't 'get' how a cat *could* appeal to someone ... why don't you tell me why I am wrong re my choice of 'companion animal' and *how* a cat would be in any way better than a dog (for me)?

Cheers, T i m

snip stupid troll plonked

Awww, don't run away and sulk NT, facts are facts, even if you don't like them. ;-(

The whole cats versus dogs (or Linux v Windows or Leave v Remain) discussions are mostly pointless because of the facts (or lack thereof re Brexit). ;-)

eg, Linux can be a perfect desktop OS to some, just as a cat can make a perfectly good companion animal to some, but Linux will never have the mass appeal / support as Windows in the same way no cat would ever replace a dog as 'mans best friend' (with all that implies).

They can't because they simply aren't as easy to integrate into a human world alongside man, especially *outside* the house (ironic for a hunter), not only because of the average size of a dog (typically bigger than that of a cat) but a dog's trainability and natural interest to please and capability to work for us, means they are simply more practical than a cat, 'as a companion animal' as defined by Wiki etc.

A 'companion' is someone who typically shares your life with you, and if your life involves going outside than that's where your 'companion cat, parrot or pot bellied pig' (typically) stops being so practical / realistic.

If you are mostly housebound and / or simply don't want your companion with you most the time and are happy to let *your* companion roam the streets un-supervised ... then a cat is about the only animal you could get away with (as you wouldn't be considered being 'responsible' if you did that with most other animals and further would be held responsible for any issues by law, unlike with a cat in most cases).

Cheers, T i m