Subsidies for generating your own lecky

Anyone else notice this article in last Saturday's FT?

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's the money bit: "Overall, says the Department of Energy and Climate Change, anyone installing a =93well-sited=94 2.5kW solar panel at a cost of around =A312,500 is likely to earn =A3900 and get around =A3140 a year off their electricity bill from it.

And you won=92t just get this money for a year. You=92ll get it for up to

25 years (depending on which technology you install).

It will also be index-linked =96 so your payments will rise every year along with inflation. And, absolutely best of all, for those of us still reeling from the small print of the Budget, it will be entirely tax-free."

The policy seems very screwy, but it does make photovoltaic cells on the roof quite an attractive idea. Anyone actually got any installed?

Reply to
Martin Pentreath
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Only a dummy one, that is used to justify selling the cheap rate electricity stored in old truck batteries back to the grid.. ;-)

Reply to
The Natural Philosopher

I'm sure its not beyond the wit of man to shovel power from the standard rate to the subsidised generated rate proportional to either wind speed or ambient light.

I'm wondering how quickly I can hit the market, any takers?

Reply to
Fredxx

If you are going to do it do it properly.. plug into next doors mains and put that out onto the grid. You get more than they pay on cheap rate so a profit to share, unless someone notices your solar panels work best at night.

Reply to
dennis

Not quite sure how you are going to get yourself certified as an approved installer of approved kit, both of which are essential requirements before you will get a bean.

Chris

Reply to
Chris J Dixon

I wonder if these micro-generation contracts are sufficiently well- written to make such scams illegal.

Reply to
dom

Blindingly obvious question: will such a solar panel last 25 years?

I tried running some numbers in my head - I get a net saving a year of considerably less than their 140 quid, and that's assuming I didn't use that money on cleaning/maintaining the panel. If that 12k panel comes with a 25 year guarantee and maintenance contract backed up by the government in case the company fails, it just about makes sense. Without that, it's bollocks.

cheers

Jules

Reply to
Jules Richardson

Or even if illegal, detectable or enforceable.

It's complete NONSENSE to allow people to sell electricity at a higher rate than they can buy it at.

Lets say I perfectly legally have - say - a photoelectric panel, a car battery storage system and an inverter.

I charge the batteries up both from cheap rate and the solar panel. I sell back at whatever rate it is. How can even I tell which particular electron came from the grid, overnight, or the solar panel?

We discussed the costs of such a system here. 20Kwh of battery is about

1700 Ah of 12v batteries. About 24 70AH batteries, to be had for less than £100 each and probably a lot less.

so lets say we charge at 3KW overnight and fully charge them, and fully discharge them by day.

WE can full arbitrage 20 units of electricity per day, bought at around

3p and sold at lords knows how much - 12p? So that's £1.80 per diem income or around £650 a year.

Not a bad return on maybe £1200 of batteries ...

And if the government wants to toss a further £900 at you for being so public spirited, I guess that means someone else's tax bill will have to rise.

Reply to
The Natural Philosopher

Its all bollocks anyway.

99% of all green stuff is.

And there is a great danger that when people realise this, they will simply say its ALL bollocks.

Reply to
The Natural Philosopher

Yes. 2kW peak. £9k installed.

Commissioned on January 22nd. ~250kWh since then..

FiT is effective from today, and is paid by your energy provider (in my case E.On) so it's not the taxpayer that will give my cashback it's other E.On customers. [Thanks chaps]

IMO rovided you have a suitably oriented roof and the cash the economic case is compelling. That however is not a view shared the majority of uk.d-i-y ers if you look at the archives.

Stuff to read: Good explanation and FAQ here:

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and here:
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'3A+your+questions+answered/Also an interesting read.

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Reply to
Vortex6

Have you worked out how much is wasted in charging the batteries from the mains? You may well find its not worth doing.

Reply to
dennis

Those numbers sound a bit too good to be true to me.

Reply to
newshound

So so far, that's =A3100. Good going.

Over a year, that's somewhere between 1500kWh (pessimistic, assuming winter weather all year) and 9000kWh (flat out, 12 hours a day). Achieving 1/6 of the credible maximum over the worst part of the year is doing pretty well, mind. In cash terms, that's somewhere =A3600 / year to =A33700. As interest rates are minimal and everyone on uk.d-i-y except me is rich, let's amortise that at 0%. So a basic payback break- even is between 15 and 2 1/2 years. With some interest taken into account, that's between about 25 and 3 years. System lifetime is probably going to survive something like that period (although my last roof didn't).

Besides which, there is some extra fluffy carbon reduction. Which is nice.

So it's not as good as investment as betting on a hung parliament, but nor is it throwing money away. I would be interested to hear more of the system you had installed, and also please keep us posted with your meter readings.

Reply to
Andy Dingley

It's not £100 so far because FiT starts today! Good practice though.

Also don't forget every kWh you generate is one you don't pay for so that's an extra 10p per unit (I have confirmed my meter goes backwards when in surplus...at least until a "smart" one is forced on us)

It's reckoned a reasonably sited 2kw array will deliver ~1600kWh annually so I have been impressed at attaining 250kWh in 9 Jan/Feb/March weeks....but the numbers are correct cos it's metered on the "official" meter (and confirmed on a less official one)

Since you're interested... some pics here, and click the .pdf for logged data so far (just updated).

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roof pitch is about 30 degrees, facing ~ 160 or 20 degrees East of South.

Reply to
Vortex5

We were somewhere around Barstow, on the edge of the desert, when the drugs began to take hold. I remember The Natural Philosopher saying something like:

Factor in battery death at approx five years even for deep discharge ones.

Reply to
Grimly Curmudgeon

You will probably have to print your own certificate... now if only printing technology were available to the general public....

Reply to
John Rumm

So it's generating 2kw for about 2 hours per day.

Would it be worth having a mechanism to track the sun all day? A motor to do that would not use much power. Or a few mirrors.

Reply to
Matty F

Have you seen the size of it? If you made that lot steerable the wind would have it next door's garden within a few days!

Reply to
Andy Burns

Not if I mount it on an old tram on a curved track!

Reply to
Matty F

You're just looking for an excuse to have a tramway in your back garden, aren't you? ;)

Reply to
Jules Richardson

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