questions about fuel and generators (incl. a legal one)

I was referring to the PSU in a full size PC.

Reply to
Cynic
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You're right. The efficency of producing electricity in bulk is about

35%, that's higher than the efficiency of an internal combustion engine alone, nevermind the generator part.

I wonder if you could use a Stirling engine and use that to run a generator. The Stirling engine can have an efficiency of up to about 80% and can run on almost any heat source. If you're off the grid maybe you could park it on top of the aga or something and have the cold cylinder outside through a wall

Reply to
Martin

It has a yellow one though and other "hiiden" markers just like red diesel. Hope he never gets stopped and dip tested by HMR&C.

Reply to
Dave Liquorice

Well aside from having to collect it in 20l containers rather than delivered in bluk I can't see cooking oil being any more hassle. The ethics of using food for fuel is another matter...

Red diesel does have duty on it but only 9.69p/l(*) compared to the 50p+/l of road (white) diesel.

(*) 10.07p/l if the rise that was due on 1st April happened. The 2p rise on road fuel duty was delayed in the Budget, I don't know if this one was. The HMR&C site hasn't been updated yet...

Yes it has VAT at 17.5% applied after the duty.

Reply to
Dave Liquorice

3000 rpm on my diesel car engine is thrashing it a bit it's happier at around 2250... The 3000rpm also assume direct drive and two(?) pole alternator. You can get 4 pole which run at 1500rpm. I think the Lister sets run at 1500rpm. You can also gear it with a box or pullys and belt.

The biggest snag with a scrapper engine will be keeping the rpm constant (or at least within a few percent) with step changes in load.

You could use a conventional steam engine, there is a sequence of development pictures and text of just that on the web somewhere. Generates a reasonable amount of power as well. I suspect I may have followed a link recently posted in uk.rec.engines.stationary. Even relatively low pressure boilers have some hefty safety regulations to comply with though. Boilers going bang is not good, bye bye building sort of not good...

Or Red diesel. Heating oil for domestic heating attract 5% VAT, I suspect other uses should have VAT applied at 17.5%.

Legal in a stationary engine and legal up to 2500l/rolling year in a road vehicle without telling HMR&C. You do need to keep records though. Bear in mind that even cheapo cooking oil is still about 80p/l. Red diesel is less than that I think somewhere around 60p/l, might be a bit more.

It's not so much the injectors as the pump seals. Some are OK with VO others fail in short order.

I'd agree with that, dump the "waste" heat into a heat bank/store of some sort. But look at those fuel prices, a litre of 28sec oil burnt in an hour produces just over 10kW. So even at 100% effciency you are looking at 6 to

8p/unit. If you can get 50% you'd be doing well, 12 to 16p/unit...
Reply to
Dave Liquorice

12vdc because of the range of items that already use it, with careful choice. As I said, my idea was to plan the entire house wiring from scratch to cope, not to retrofit to cope with the OTT loads we all have now; ie./ it wouldn't necessarily be a 1:1 functional replacement.

Phil.

Reply to
Phil

We were somewhere around Barstow, on the edge of the desert, when the drugs began to take hold. I remember John Nagelson saying something like:

Don't, just don't. Kerosene has nothing like the same lubricity as diesel, and you run the risk of wrecking your injection pump. Kerosene can be used if you are utterly sure of what you're doing, by adding mineral oil to it in the right proportion.

Steam raising is fraught with danger, but not impossible. The fact you are asking the question points that you are not that able to do it safely.

Red diesel is the thing for that, but HM Gov have bumped up the price of it now.

Of course it is - safe, practicable and legal too. You really need to do some research on your own, though. As a starting point, do a google search for this very subject and spend a couple of weeks absorbing knowledge.

Reply to
Grimly Curmudgeon

We were somewhere around Barstow, on the edge of the desert, when the drugs began to take hold. I remember "Dave Liquorice" saying something like:

'Hoof' engine governor. You can find one on ebay.com

Reply to
Grimly Curmudgeon

Why?

Reply to
Doctor Drivel

A SMPS to generae other voltages from 12 is not more complex,and indeed often simpler,than an SMPS to generate 12v from the mains..

The main problem with 12v is the massive cabling and connectors needed for any sort of power.

Reply to
The Natural Philosopher

Welland governors are reasonably accurate.

Reply to
Alasdair

Disagree!

Kerosene, light oil, lamp oil, jet fuel, heating paraffin, and 28sec heating oil are sort of the same thing.

Diesel, heavy oil, 35sec heating oil are much the same thing. The stuff which is untaxed is dyed red. It may not be used to power vehicles on public roads.

A Diesel engine may well work (and possibly just thrive) with the wrong fuel an oil fired heating appliance won't.

Reply to
Ed Sirett

: >> 3) how easy is it to run a generator fuelled by DIESEL? And surely if : >> you do, you don't have to pay petrol-station prices? Is there a legal : >> way to avoid paying the excise? : >

: > Diesel and kerosene are essentially the same but with different tax : > rates. : >

Just run it on vegetable oil, it's a whole hell of a lot cheaper and reduces wear and tear over diesel.

Reply to
Cork Soaker

Red is in the mid 60s p/l(*) veg oil from the likes of CostCo or Makro nearer 80p/l.

(*) Based on kero being just over 50p/l and adding about 12p for the duty and VAT. This works with road fuels as well, 60p duty & VAT on a base oil cost of around 50p. Small ball park...

Reply to
Dave Liquorice

Agreed, more or less.

It is taxed red diesel carries 10p(ish) of duty plus VAT at 17.5%.

28sec oil used for domestic heating has not duty and VAT at 5%. It is dyed yellow and has hidden markers as well just like red.
Reply to
Dave Liquorice

It WILL, for a while, but tends to carbon up the jets.

Reply to
The Natural Philosopher

As has been said many times, taking an on-grid house off grid pretty much never makes sense.

Just one thing I'd say though: a lot of people are talking about

10kVA plus gensets. If you want as much power as now minus heating, already, that's what it will take, but the norm is to dramatically reduce consumption first, such that 1.5kW peak is enough, and this can come from an invertor. Laptops replace desktops, 500w microwaves (1kW input) replace 800w, etc

One or 2 not mentioned yet: Space heating: solar air & solid fuel. Space cooling: plant shading, whitewash, whole house fan, night time solar panels refrigeration: gas Hot water: concentrating solar, heat scavenging (invertor, genny etc) Lighting: fluorescent / CFL, not LED Washing machine: wind driven agitation if long wash times are acceptable

NT

Reply to
meow2222

We were somewhere around Barstow, on the edge of the desert, when the drugs began to take hold. I remember Alasdair saying something like:

Depends on what the surplus situation is. Hoof are easily available cheaply and are quite good for mounting on VW diesels. I'll have a look for Welland, ta.

Reply to
Grimly Curmudgeon

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