Piggin PMF 180

[The Medway Handyman]

My second Bosch PMF180 packed up today, half way through a piggin job. Not even had that much use.

Seems to be the same problems as the first one - the switch.

Anyone else had trouble?

[John Rumm]

As a trade user do you not suppose it would be worth getting one of the blue Bosch versions or indeed the Fein?

[The Medway Handyman]

If I were a heavy trade user then maybe, but I only use one every couple of weeks & then not for a long period.

It's the nature of the tool really, it's not really used like a drill driver would be. It's for odd embuggerance jobs.

[John Rumm]

Every couple of weeks is still likely to be ten times joe public's average use. Remember some budget tools are specced for as little as 10 hours of run time.

[newshound]

Yes but this isn't really "budget" and IME even green bosch is normally fairly durable. My only portable circular saw is a green bosch and I've had it for 30 years (it's had one replacement drive gear in that time).

[The Other Mike]

You should have bought a Fein :)

(fingers crossed touches wood hopes my Fein doesn't pack in now)

[Andy Dingley]

Mine blew up in my hand.

OK, so just the filter capacitor, but it still cost a tenner.

[dom]

I would really recommend the Fein. I bought one of the first generation ones, really heavy built, heavily used, and occasionally abused - and no sign that anything is likely to fail anytime.

[usenet2012]

In message , John Rumm writes

You must be kidding??? Please!!! Which tools???

[A.Lee]

I have to agree, I had the green Bosch, then upgraded to the cordless blue, now I have the basic Fein corded. Each were better than the earlier one by a large margin. The green Bosch vibrated terribly, the blue cordless less so, the Fein is another improvement. Quick release tools are another bonus, and yes, the Aldi tools fit.

Alan.

[John Rumm]

When you think about it, for many tools, ten hours of actual run time will represent many many years worth of intermittent use on projects round the home. I am not suggesting that the green Bosch tools are quite in this category[1] - you would normally expect somewhat more, but they are not aimed at the trade user. So ultimate life will be shorter, and actual duty cycle far more limited.

[1] we are talking down in the Power devil, kinzo basement... plastic gearboxes etc.

[larkim]

Presumably ripe for a replacement under SoGA, or does that not apply as the purchase would have been business-to-business?

Matt

[Andrew May]

And how do we define 'use'? If I spend half an hour putting 200 nails in with a nail gun is that half an hour of use or 200 * x milliseconds where x is the time it takes for the nail to be driven home?

[John Rumm]

I mean actual run time, not elapsed time. So the actual hours of operation of the tool, not the time spent doing the job with it sat beside you most of the time.

(nail guns are probably easier to quantify in terms of total shots!)

[polygonum]

I remember hearing (quite possibly rumour - but from someone who visited their offices and wondered at their staff using Wolf tools) that B&D electric drills had a one hour design life. And that was plenty for most purchasers. Christmas present. Drill a few holes a year. Then replaced by the next Christmas present.

[newshound]

Doesn't sound right to me. I still have the B&D drill which my father bought in the 1960's and while I havn't run it for a long time AFAIK it still works. And one of the plastic case / metal gearbox "professional" ones I bought for my first house in about 1975 which had heavy use for many years. I think it's had a couple of sets of brushes, and a re-grease but nothing else.

[polygonum]

Mine from that era certainly became sparky, dust-filled and noisy - but did actually last considerably longer.

[js.b1]

So it was not just mine. I used it twice, the first time the noise due to resonance was absolutely s= taggering, the second time the neighbours went to Australia...

The Swiss green bosch jigsaw runs like a sewing machine despite quite horri= ble garden & hardwood abuse with utterly worn out blades.

Bosch green garden hedge trimmer admittedly on laurel seems to last ok, the= n get a nasty & rather knocking sound when the brake applies and vibration = jumps markedly. Petrol harsh on the ear drums, a pro-end electric hedge tri= mmer would be nice although proper pro-end often comes with Mr Farmer attac= hed as many know :-)

Quite true tools have a designed-in running time; try Draper battery screwd= rivers compared to a Makita. Tools in the 1970s were somewhat more primitiv= e, but if metal cased and pro-targetted were simple but robust. Closer to H= ilti before things descended into more DIY and then now bargain basement. S= o much stuff does NOT last, partly by design such as iObsolete failure rate= s.

[stuart noble]

Don't include the Power Devil circular saws in that because mine must be

20 years old and, for a good few years, was abused 2-3 times a week. By contrast a Bosch power scraper fell apart after a year or so. Must be quite expensive to engineer obsolescence?

[dom]

Value engineering.

Having done some, I have respect for the rather specialised art of shaving off every fraction of a penny possible - and making it crap, but not too crap.