OT: Organ donation should be compulsory, not just "opt out"

On Feb 20, 2021 at 9:05:50 PM MST, "Joel" wrote snipped-for-privacy@4ax.com:

Fewer than 1% of all abortions, and when they do happen it is generally because of:

• Challenges in being able to get an abortion sooner -- so the right wingers who add hurdles are a key reason for this edge case they claim to be concerned with. These hurdles can be financial or having a clinic near by.
• Fetal anomalies: generally structural in nature, and when there is little chance for viability. Yet right wingers want to force the woman to give birth to a non-viable baby. It is cruelty.
• High risk to the pregnant woman. They promote death as they claim to be pro-life.

On Feb 20, 2021 at 9:10:49 PM MST, ""Rod Speed"" wrote snipped-for-privacy@mid.individual.net>:

The woman has one body, and SHE gets to decide what she does with it. Not you, just as she does not get to decide what you do with your body.

On Feb 20, 2021 at 9:13:05 PM MST, ""Rod Speed"" wrote snipped-for-privacy@mid.individual.net>:

In controlling the woman's body. The very thing you just said it was NOT about. Make up your mind.

Good idea as it avoids procedures such as amniocentesis that may endanger mother and foetus. See what comes out and decide whether we want it to live.

The difference between a late abortion and infanticide is birth, which is an event *in* life, not its start.

What if the man will be expected to pay to raise a child which may not be his?

It may be the result of adultery, or rape, and the mother might want to keep it and the man not. Why should the man not have a say in this?

If the alleged father has doubts, he can get a paternity test.

No he can't. He can't get a paternity test on an unborn child. And if he can, he can't force his wife to abort.

Well, of course he can't force her to abort, but if the child isn't his, he's under no obligation to support it. Personally, if my wife were to bear a child conceived by rape, I would support whatever decision she made with regard to giving the child up for adoption or keeping it, but if it were the result of adultery, I'd probably want to get a divorce, and let her and the other man deal with the child. Different men would come to different conclusions in such circumstances, and that's understandable, but when it comes to the decision to have an abortion, I don't see how the man's opinion is relevant unless the woman seeks it in making her decision.

You replied to "Only the woman can make the decision about abortion"

with, "Wrong, as always. The state does too"

Thank you, so I wasn't wrong.

From someone in denial that most contraceptives have the fallback position of discouraging implantation.

What if he still wants the woman for sex?

That's his business.

the issue is that abortion is not murder, whereas infanticide is. However hard you would wish that not to be the case.

It's only odd in your head.

So not "wrong".

Evidence of a another lost argument.

On Feb 21, 2021 at 7:02:51 AM MST, "Joel" wrote snipped-for-privacy@4ax.com:

I can see offering it even if she did not request it... but it is still her body and not mine.