OT: New Bread Maker required

[Clive George]

You can get new tins for some. If you're happy with the way the machine works it might be a good approach.

[John Rumm]

I have not looked at recent comparative reviews, but seem to recall Panasonic was always one of the favourites in the past.

[Gordon Henderson]

If anywhere near Devon give me a shout if you want some of mine, but it's not hard to get going from scratch.

Gordon

[Gordon Henderson]

Sounds weird, but I'm sure the boffins in Panasonic HQ know what they're doing... Maybe!

Sugar will make the yeast act a bit better, but a modern yeast really shouldn't need it.

The butter will help make the dough a little more smooth, so maybe that's why its needed? It also helps to make the bread last a little longer by slowing down the loss of moisture and helps to promote a more even crumb structure - that probably why it makes it look like it's risen more.

I'll need to have a good look inside one at some point - last time I looked, it seemed to me to be nothing more than a sort of L shaped paddle which I'm somewhat surprised can effectively mix everything together..

I do know someone who uses the bread maker to mix/knead and do the initial prove of their dough, then they take it out and hand-shape it into rolls, etc.

Gordon

[Adrian]

Horizontally, near. Vertically, not far. Time, long way. We're in the Marches.

This thread has prompted me. I shall do some research and get one going.

[LumpHammer]

I vote for the Panasonic as well. The wholemeal bread is tastier than most supermarket stuff, and it's much more convenient than having to shop for fresh bread every 2-3 days. Also, when the zombie/ebola/tanker-driver apocalypse happens, I will have enough flour in the cupboard to make bread for several months, assuming the electricity stays on.

[harryagain]

Fortunately someone kindly came up with the comment that Morphy Richards' instructions were too prescriptive and changing the sequence of adding the mix sorted the problem.

Now the machine has come to the end of it's life - the paddle bushing had worn to the point that fluid from the mix was leaking out.

We need a replacement - do any of the 'closet' have a recommendation for a machine that reliably produces wholemeal type bread as that seems to be the weakness of some of the market offerings.

Thanks

We have had several Panasonic Breadsmades. Used twice a week seem to last about twelve/thirteen years. Not the cheapest but does a really good job.

[harryagain]

In the standard programme it lets the dough rises & knocks it down & then it rises again. In the fast programme it lets it rise only once. Bread's a bit heavier then.

[Gordon Henderson]

I keep mine in 1 liter kilner jars..

Get 150g of flour - preferably stoneground organic wholemeal. (ie. not sprayed and with as much "stuff" on it as possible which means there will be more natural yeasts. Put that in jar. Add in 150g of water. Stir with hand.

Leave loosely covered for 24 hours.

Then add 100g of white flour and 100g of water. Stir and leave another

24 hours covered.

Repeat that.

Now take half of it out and use it to make pancakes.

Add another 100g of white flour and 100g of water

and it really should be there by now - bubbling away and smelling a bit yeasty. It can live in the fridge now.

To use: Take 200g of starter from the jar in the fridge, put in a big bowl. Top-up the starter with 100g of flour and 100g of water, stir and back in the fridge it goes.

Add to the bowl 500g of strong white flour, 6g of salt and 270g of water. Mix, knead, put back in bowl, cover with clingfilm and leave overnight (draft-free, 20C ish room). In the morning, tip it out, shape into a boulle or put it in a proving basket - leave another 2 hours, turn out, slash and fire.... (250C for 12 minutes, 200C for 25)

There are many different ways to manage the starter and make bread, but that's essentially my usual way.

It may take a few goes before the starter gets really going but it's no more complicated than that, and if your kneading skills are up to it, add more water, but you might find you do need to use a banneton for it to hold its shape while proving...

Gordon

[Andy Burns]

I make mostly wholemeal (or ~75%) in my Panasonic (SD253 or something like that) it also comes with a "comb" paddle supposedly for spelt, but I've never used it ... L or XL wholemeal takes 5 hours including 1 hour of preheating the ingredients before it starts.

[Clive George]

That's pretty much it. The shape of the tin might make a difference too.

[Chris French]

In message , Gordon Henderson writes

I'm doubtful that is the actual ingredients list from a typical loaf, though I don't disagree that lots of those ingredients might be in there.

I've got a loaf of Warburton's Toastie Sliced White Bread here (yes I know.... :-) )

It's got flour, the legally required vitamins, yeast, salt, oil, soya flour, a couple of emulsifiers, calcium Propionate as a preservative, and a couple of flour treatment agents (Ascorbic Acid, and L-Cysteine.

TBH, for a large scale commercially produced product that's a reasonable ingredient list.

Still missing our lovely village bakery though, that was right opposite our house closed down about 18 months ago :-(

[Bod]

[Andrew Gabriel]

Panasonic can bake a loaf in just under 2 hours.

5 hours is the longest bake program it has AFAIK.

Yes, you have to be ready to take the loaf out when it's done, but that's because loaves need to cool out of the tin in air - that's part of the process. If you leave them in, the crust will go soggy. The Panasonic will keep the loaf heated for up to an hour after the baking, to give you a chance if you miss it finishing baking, but the sooner you take it out to air the better it will be.

Panasonic also allows you to extend the bake time (which it does by delaying the start), so you can set a loaf to take 8 hours when you go to bed and it's ready to take out when you wake up.

Usually, it's pretty self-cleaning if you use a bake program. Mine is 16+ years old now and had loads of use, and the tin and paddle are not as non-stick as they were.

Fastest I've done it it 1.5 hours, but that was using the machine just to do the neading, and I then handled the rising and baking in my oven. 1:55 is the fastest the Panasonic machine can do it fully automatically (unless newer models have faster programs).

[Chris French]

Yes I know, the Warburton's bread is made using the process.

My point was that I do not believe the list you gave is a typical list of ingredients for such a loaf

[polygonum]

Quite a number of years ago we got a Panasonic SD253. Used it a fair bit. But then found that partner could no longer tolerate wheat/gluten. Tried gluten-free approaches but none was satisfactory. So it has ended up in the loft for years. (Not worth doing for one.)

My experience when using it made me want a much more flexible machine. One which allowed very long, cool rising. Basically, I wanted to connect to the network and be able set up my own program.

Perhaps one of the biggest advantages is that a breadmaker uses considerably less electricity than the main cooker oven.

[Gordon Henderson]

I think you may be surprised )-: Although I don't think that's a typical white loaf - might be something else - an enriched dark wheat or something. Hard to tell without the loaf name..

One of the issues that people are suggesting/claiming is that it's not just the ingredients, but the actual processing - the high speed mixing and quicker rising producing a product that's more detrimental to our health than traditional long (or longer) rising times.

I know my bread tastes nicer than shop-bough stuff and people keep buying it, so I feel I'm doing something right!

So there's a market there then - get baking :)

I was supplying 4-6 loaves a day to the local shop and a month ago the local co-op closed for 10 days for a refurb. so I doubled production and I'm plesantly surprised that now, 2 weeks after the co-op re-opened, shiney, new with a bigger bread tanning section, I'm still selling 10-12 leaves a day in the local shop... The other shop I supply has taken more bread too, although they are in the middle of Dartmoor and get a bigger delivery from a local bakery every few days.

Gordon

[Adam Funk]

We have had a Panasonic (with the extra seed/raisin trapdoor, which I use as I am a seedy person) for a couple of years & are also quite happy with it.

Before that, we had a Morphy-Richards which was also good. It gradually died (over a year or so) after falling off the worktop onto the floor because I was running it directly over the washing machine during a spin cycle.

[Tony Bryer]

When I was buying (2011), someone told me to buy a Panasonic - which I did, although it was much more expensive than most. Several hundred loaves later I have no regrets.

My preferred mix is 50/50 wholemeal and Barossa sourdough rye, 330g + 250ml water - the standard 600g makes a loaf that is too tall and hard to slice for my liking.

[Adam Funk]

Now that you mention that, it was one of the things I liked about our old Morphy-Richards one --- several years after the original purchase, they sold me a replacement pan at a reasonable price.