OT French Kettles

Then more fool the catering firm for being so reliant on one customer. They should have actively sought other customers and/or restructured their business a long time previously.

Clearly there is incompetence on BA's part for not realising this earlier and doing something about it.

However, there should be legal and financial consequences for said baggage handlers and others not directly involved in the dispute to withdraw their labour in regard to a dispute that is in a different company and different operational area.

I suppose that it is sufficiently long after the wrecking of industry in the 60s and 70s by inappropriate industrial action for people to remember the eventual consequences.

Reply to
Andy Hall
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I used the expression "laid people off" in the generic sense, be it termination for cause, redundancy or temporary stand down.

Whatever the reason is, it is not justification for employees of other companies or in totally unrelated areas to withdraw their labour on the basis of said dispute.

That's fine, but this should not be without consequences for those withdrawing their labour on this basis and liability for any union involvement.

Hopefully those vestiges will pass, justifiably into industrial history as soon as possible.

The consequences of inappropriate union strength and especially of secondary action are very obvious in terms of their eventual effect on sectors where they were typical in the 60s and 70s.

Of course. However, it is not appropriate to do so if you are not directly involved in the dispute as an employee.

The catering firm has been in a situation where it hasn't made a profit since 2000 and its revenues have fallen 35% since 2001. Faced with the reality of that, there is no other option than to find ways to restructure the business and to cut costs. They had tried for several months to reach agreements with unions and employees and change working practices in order to match the reality that they are working in.

Part of that reality (I believe a small part) is said to be due to the WTC bombings. I think that a much bigger part is the change in the market dynamic of people wanting cheap and no frills air travel. THe inevitable consequence of that is that business of the airline catering firms is adversely affected.

I can't find anything to suggest that the company's offer was outside the law, but was what was required to secure the future of the company, which is not a charitable organisation. If, at the end of the day, some of the employees don't want to accept what's on offer, they have the option of looking for other jobs or doing as they did and withdrawing their labour. However, they can't expect to do so without there being consequences of termination of employment if said activity puts them outside their employment contract.

As to the directors of BA or even the middle managers.... they work for a different company. However, their bonuses should be hit for not having a contingency in place in terms of an alternative catering supplier and alternative baggage handling.

Reply to
Andy Hall

I'm not sure about the French, but in Italian houses there are two types of socket, 10A and 16A, although usually most sockets are 16A with a secondary set of connectors to take a 10A plug. TBH operating a 2.2kW load from a 10A socket sounds to me like pushing the limits but I suppose that it may be reason that the kettles are limited to 2.2kW.

As to cookers, as in the UK, single ovens can be fitted with a plug (16A), larger ovens need to be wired in.

Reply to
Steve Firth

What utter crap. If you don't like your job, you quit. That simple. You don't hold your employer to ransom until they give in to your demands.

Reply to
Grunff

Its not that simple. The employer doesn't have carte blanche to do what he want's. You do what you have to do. In this case, it may have worked. good luck to them. Any company that sacks employees who were off on holiday or sick on that day don't deserve any sympathy.

Reply to
Paul Giverin

And this is usually what happens. Think I've been technically sacked three times. ;-)

Contrary to general belief, few want to strike. After all you don't get paid when on strike, and most work because they need the money to live on.

All strikes have a reason. And it takes two groups to create this reason - workers and management. Unfortunately, the media rarely give the full facts of the dispute. It's only when you become personally involved in one that you realise this for certain.

Reply to
Dave Plowman (News)

And bigger fool BA for relying on one supplier. But then they can squeeze the prices paid rather easier that way.

Reply to
Dave Plowman (News)

And those miners who refused to go on strike have still got jobs?

There is little 'traditional' industry in this country as we simply can't compete with the far east etc on cost.

Reply to
Dave Plowman (News)

I'm sure a SMEG oven I bought had the possibility of being connected to a 3 phase supply by a cunning re-arrangement of links. Can't quite see how they could do that unless they just put the top oven on one phase and the bottom one on another. The main (fan) oven only has one element on at a time.

DG

Reply to
Derek ^

Most strikes start the other way. The employer is doing the aggression, as in this case.

Reply to
Dave Plowman (News)

It becomes a circular issue. People want to pay as little for things as they can and then wonder why local industry declines.

Reply to
Andy Hall

The industrial sectors were lost purely because people were inflexible and priced themselves out of the market.

Reply to
Andy Hall

Trying to restructure their business in order to stem losses in a declining market size inevitably is going to result in a loss of hours worked. Either that can be accomplished by changing working practices and hours of people that are there or replacing those people with others who are willing to accept a changed arrangement.

This doesn't amount to aggression, simply trying to deal with a commercial reality. There aren';t really any alternatives when a company has been losing money for five years and has lost a third of its revenue.

Reply to
Andy Hall

So the banks etc *need* to move their call centres to India to survive? For example?

I don't know the ins and outs of this particular case, but if they've been losing money for 5 years why didn't they do something about it before?

Reply to
Dave Plowman (News)

Some friends recently bought an oven / gas hob (an impressive beast - not Smeg, but a similar up-market brand) with such an arrangement. It was supplied with two controller modules (presumably potted triacs) that were fitted as alternatives for single or three phase.

Reply to
Andy Dingley

Except by charging more for their services and paying a reasonable living wage out of that. They accepted an impossible contract believing they could bully a subservient and impotent workforce into taking all the strain of the too low prices. It didn't work out as planned.

Reply to
John Cartmell

There are. How about legal restraints on companies that sack employees with no warning and for no reason?

Reply to
John Cartmell

Quite a few! ;-) I happened to be visiting a school when her resignation was announced and the cheers were quite spontaneous (and loud!) as the news travelled around the place. A good few will have reason for long memories.

Reply to
John Cartmell

It's a judgment call that they can make but then have to accept the consequences - i.e. customers may not like it and will shop elsewhere.

Also, the labour costs in India are starting to increase, so I suspect it won't be that long before there is a migration back.

Very good question. I wasn't suggesting that the catering firm was beyond reproach. One does wonder why they didn't try to attract other business. Possibly they did, but BA would still represent by far the largest catering contract out of LHR anyway, and most of the recent airline growth (or lack of shrinkage) has been in the cheap sector anyway, where catering is not a significant factor.

Reply to
Andy Hall

...and I thought Drivel had the exclusive licence on talking bollocks here.

Reply to
Matt

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