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[Rick]

Rick

[--s-p-o-n-i-x--]

ARe B&Q in *that* much financial trouble?

sponix

[Andy Hall]

They have simply restructured their retail capacity to match changed market conditions. This is a responsible thing to do to protect the business in the longer term.

[david lang]

Hi All

Just noticed that B&Q Performance Power range of power tools has changed colour to grey/white and Screwfix have started selling Titan, which look suspiciously like Performance Pro in blue/yellow.

What is going on here?

No wonder they are having problems!

Dave

[Andy Hall]

B&Q and Screwfix are volume warehousing operations. That's it. The business model is based on cost, volume and margin. A relatively fixed cost is the space used to store and retail the goods. This is why B&Q has most low value goods stacked in high racks and only those that have to be layed out further to sell at all and higher value/margin items are spread out. Key measured parameters are the turnover and margin per square metre and the number of turns per year of stock. If the space can produce a higher rate of return by renting it out to other complementary businesses then it is a consideration.

The so-called Performance Power, Titan etc. "brands" are simply shells. There is no long term commitment to a given product or even style and no proper backup provided.

Volume operations like SF and B&Q don't want to deal with these issues. The equation is that they agree to a certain volume with a Chinese factory and if the volume/price equation is there, agree the colours and the label for a period of time or volume. The so-called warranties are carefully calculated as a marketing exercise on the basis that if the tool is cheap enough, people won't bother to return it or will throw it away and buy another. There will be certain return rates which are factored into the cost of the line and may even be pushed back to the manufacturer.

The reality is that these are all cheap generic Chinese products in a given colour and packaging. They will continue to come and go.

There is no problem with this as long as people understand that this is what they are getting. However, too often I have seen people in the returns area of B&Q trying to get spares for one of these products or to get something done after the warranty. Of course it's non existent, but for some reason people seem to think that they can expect the same type and level of product cover that they would have had if they had bought Bosch, Makita, etc.

IMO, that is not an acceptable way of marketing. The customer has been given the impression from the warranty that there really is a proper brand with all the backup. The reality is that there is a veneer.

So if the Kingfisher group changes things around and the same product appears in a different colour from another outlet, this is not an indicator of having problems, but simply a natural outcome of this type of product and how it is marketed. No surprises at all.

[AlexW]

True.

Lets be fair, not entirely "non-existent".

Perfomance Pro Helpline is on 0845 300 2577.

As mentioned in an earlier thread, they offered to get parts for me...

I have no affilation with Kingfisher or subs.

[Andy Hall]

This is better than nothing, but somehow I doubt if it would be comprehensive across the range or lasting for a long period.

[AlexW]

No, I would not expect to be able to source parts many years down the line. And my experience was for a SCMS which was relatively expensive at £130 for them.

Alex

[manatbandq]

See

're going the same way as Homebase "Out go hundreds of lines of nuts and bolts, in come DVD players and television sets."

Although they try to deny it "When asked whether the move was merely copying Homebase, which is owned by GUS, he said: "Our proposition will be very different from Homebase... but if we stay in the same market it is unclear why we would ever increase sales"

MBQ

[Capitol]

The point which I notice is that the B & Q stores have lost any semblance of order or cleanliness. I guess the staff have become demoralised. Also, the stock is virtually identical to Homebase/Focus/Wickes, it is what I understand as "Sheep Syndrome" (copyright CSLtd), ie all stores have the same suppliers and stock. This is certain death to any business. The success of Texas Homecare 20+ years ago was their willingness to take risks with the products that they were offering. B & Q have lost this ability. They are well behind Homebase, in say stocking a complete steam shower cubicle and their brassware selection is utterly unimaginative. ( Even Lidl can outsell them!!) Their general product range condemns them to low profit margins and "poor" customers. MFI have at least recognised that there are profits in stocking Neff, Miele and Fisher & Paykel products.

B & Q are also uncompetitive on simple products such as replacement lampshades and "Chinese" tools. They are just not in touch with the market and rely on customer ignorance to get away with ridiculously high prices for many cheap products. Competitors such as "Pound shops", "Wilkinsons" or "Range" are running rings around them in terms of persuading the customers to part with their money!! To quote the old maxim, " 2.5% of something is worth a lot more than 50% of nothing." Even the pensioners have given up spending their money there on a Wednesday!!

They should send their buyers to look at say "Menards" in the USA to find a few new diy products which would attract some customers.

Regards Capitol

[Andy Hall]

I tend to agree. It is surprising, because they did a slavish job of copying Home Depot almost to the finest detail including logo, colours and concepts.

With this latest chosen change, it will be interesting to see if they clean up their act.

The borg has split out "fashionable" products for the home into an operation called Expo Design Center.

These stores are typically next to HD stores but separate.

[david lang]

Capitol wrote: || The point which I notice is that the B & Q stores have lost any || semblance of order or cleanliness. I guess the staff have become || demoralised.

I'd agree with that, but it varies. I live on the edge of Strood, Kent, so I'm about equidistant between a B&Q in Strood, a Wickes in Chatham and the same two stores in Gravesend.

The difference is incredible, both the Gravesend stores are cleaner, tidier and have much more of what you want in stock. Staff are more helpful & knowledgeable - different world. Must be the managers.

|| Also, the stock is virtually identical to || Homebase/Focus/Wickes, it is what I understand as "Sheep Syndrome" || (copyright CSLtd), ie all stores have the same suppliers and stock.

I'd defend Wickes, they are more heavyside than B&Q or Homebase, not to mention cheaper on most stuff.

Homebase is turning into a toyshop, not a DIY store. Only saving grace is the panel cutting service. Focus is cramped, dirty and the staff have an attitude problem round here.

|| B & Q are also uncompetitive on simple products such as replacement || lampshades and "Chinese" tools. They are just not in touch with the || market and rely on customer ignorance to get away with ridiculously || high prices for many cheap products.

No doubt about that, local plumbing shop regularly kicks B&Q's ass on price.

Dave

[david lang]

wounded horse wrote: || Their plumbing/heating range has been 50% missing for 3 || months and when I enquired as to why there was virtually no stock of || toilet valves/parts I was told that their supplier had gone bust.

My local B&Q has been out of plastic carrier bags for the last three weeks :-)

Supplier blamed again!

Dave

[manatbandq]

I used to have that attitude and also a feeling that they (Homebase) were expensive. That was all changed at the weekend. First of all we found a bathroom suite we liked in the "half price sale". When I asked when the next 10% off day was, they did a deal by marking down the items that were in stock such that I got 10% off the whole order (the rest to be delivered). I don't know if the fact B&Q were running a 10% promo at the weekend was relevant.

Then, wanting some plumbing fittings, off we went to B&Q. The display was absolutely appaling, with hooks crammed in everywhere, half of which had the wrong items hanging on them. The queues were long (probably due to the 10% promo) and they didn't have half of what I wanted either. Back to Homebase, the store is clean, bright and every item was in stock, correctly priced and labelled and the prices weren't all that bad. Guess who got the business. In future, Homebase will be first, rather than last resort as it is actually more convenient for me.

MBQ