how to copy a victorian ceiling mounding

Can anyone advise me please? I want to soundproof an alcove in our victorian terraced house; next door have removed a chimney breast and installed a piano against the party wall.

For sound proofing here will be a new stud wall across the alcove, not in contact with the party wall, faced with 2 or three sheets of p/b with rockwook fill in the space. If that's not enough I will build another in front of the first.

My problem is the nice ceiling moulding which will be hidden behind the new stud wall(s). Ideally I'd like to take a copy of it and cast a new one onto the ceiling and new wall.

has anyone done such copying/casting?

Reply to
RobertL
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Your problem is not the ceiling moulding, it's the neighbour. Noise abatement?

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Reply to
Richard

Quite so :-)

Aside from the visible part of the wall, I'd look above the ceiling and below the floor. Check for loose brick and any other gaps.

I'd guess the nature of the noise might help troubleshoot. Say, higher frequency and intelligible speech suggest movement through air, and gaps in brick. Lower frequency thuds and bumps suggest lack of mass, and lightweight porous construction. I'd stress the word 'guess' :-)

Reply to
RJH

These "mouldings" were constructed in situ by passing a former over wet plaster applied to the ceiling/wall junction. It was done progressively in many layers. The former is just s thin piece of wood with one edge cut to the desired shape, at the desired angle. I have only seen it done once, highly skilled work. Any fancy patterns (mouldings) are made of plaster of paris, stuck on with more plaster of paris.

All from the days when plastering was a profession.

Reply to
harryagain

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NT

Reply to
meow2222

Asking the neighbour to move the piano might be a simpler solution!

I have seen it done once by a specialist repairer after a tenant in the upstairs apartment above our premises installed themselves a shower

*without* bothering to plumb in the drain! I am *NOT* kidding !!!

Most of the boardroom ceiling came down and crumpled one cylindrical steel leg of the large meeting table. The plaster dust totally wrecked all the inkjet printers in the premises for good measure. We were very lucky it happened at the weekend if anyone had been in there it could have been fatal! It was all repaired by the landlords insurance and his upstairs tenants were evicted as a result of their negligence.

The way they did it was to take silicone or latex mouldings from the remaining good parts and then cast chunks offsite and attach them. I didn't get to see how they stuck the new parts back up to the main ceiling. It took them quite a while to finish it with many visits.

I think you will find it very hard to do a decent job unless you have a lot of experience working with plastering ceilings and plaster casting.

Fred Aldous has the latex and suitable remeltable PVC plastics for making the moulds - you will also need to make a support for the mould.

Don't do anything irreversible until you have been able to cast some matching ceiling moulding of an acceptable quality.

Reply to
Martin Brown

Not if it contains flowers etc as many do. Those were cast off site.

Reply to
Dave Plowman (News)

I suspect it will need that as well.

Robert

Reply to
RobertL

Thank you that's a good lead.

Robert

Reply to
RobertL

Yes, I didn't go into full details of the soundproofing. I plan to go belo w the floor and into the ceiling/floorboard void above and remove all mecha nical contact with the existing (solid) party wall. The bedroom above alr eady has soundproofing but it stops at floorboard level. Closing off the f lanking paths is very important as you point out.

My experience upstairs was very good. Before we added the soundproofing we could hear the baby crying next door very clearly, and conversation. Afte rwards we could hear nothing.

The transmission seems to be quite broad spectrum. I have a dB meter and m ost of the sound does seem to becoming directly through the wall right behi nd their piano. I expect there is some transmission via the underfloor void also which I will need to take care of at the same time.

We do have our own piano (not against the party wall) and I would like to p rotect them from ours also.

Robert

Reply to
RobertL

Not going for "Duelling Pianos" then :-)

Reply to
newshound

It may prove easier (and cheaper) to simply replace the lot with new 'foam' stuff. Which looks very good.

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Reply to
Dave Plowman (News)

Just a bit of sheet metal, a few scarps of wood, and practice:

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Aiui a corner molding is made similarly, but "drawn" in a corner, with straw put in the bottom it to give it strength. Castings were sometimes made in molds of gelled hide glue...

Thomas Prufer

Reply to
Thomas Prufer

Saw a friend do it once - just to replace a one off straight section. He used a combination of techniques, but it seemed to work ok.

Starting with a accurate tracing of the profile, he made a ply template to act as a profiling tool. Then rather than try and do it in place made up a long ply trough to hold the section. Lined the bottom of it with scrim and some EML. Then poured in the fist mix of plaster. After that had gone off, added another mix and profiled that with the template. Basically repeating that until it was full enough, and the final pass of the template was leaving behind the required profile.

Reply to
John Rumm

Doing it properly is a dying art but there is another approach, which might feel a bit of a cheat, but may work for you. I went to the homebuilding and renovating show last year at the NEC. There was a stand there selling preformed mouldings that (according to them) could be assembled in combinations to replicate almost any traditional pattern. I thought it seemed a useful resource at the time but haven't had cause to make use of them since. Can't recall if the products were plaster or something else (may have been a mix).

Unfortunately, I can't recall the name of the firm and SWMBO seems to have 'cleared up' (ie binned) all the propaganda I picked up there, but I remember they had a fairly extensive web site, so a bit of time with google and/or looking up the exhibitors at that show might be productive.

Reply to
GMM

In article , GMM writes

Lots of this going on in Glasgow, here's some inspiration:

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(really slow site)

Ready made may save a lot of work if the o/p can find a match.

Reply to
fred

In article , Dave Plowman (News) writes

Thanks for that Dave, good looks and prices.

Hacking off the old stuff might be a bit messy though.

Reply to
fred

I don't think you've said if this is a plain coving or an ornate moulded one. Plain ought to do able in place with a template and smooth flat runners fixed either side so that imperfections in wall or ceiling don't get transfered to the cove.

If it's ornate maybe you could (try to) move the bit you are going to hide. I wouldn't like to rate your chances of getting it off though. Small sections maybe 9" long with the breaks/joins carefully chosen in relation to the pattern might make it easier. And cut away with a drywall saw rather than pry.

Reply to
Dave Liquorice

I'm not the o/p but what you say is valid either way.

I can't help feeling that an amateur will tend to screw up an in situ template draw with wobbles and minor deviations, particularly when running inverted.

If I couldn't find an off the shelf profile I'd try to draw the profile at ground level then stick it up later, then only the perfect ones get used.

I've made minor repairs on smooth runs by fixing planed battens in place as moulds then filled and sanded back to the main profile to finish. For longer replacement sections I'd consider moulding a few simple rectangular sections and sanding off the edges to match the original profile.

Reply to
fred

it's only about 8" wide and 3 ft long. I was wondering if I could just 'hack it off and then carefully fix it together again. I did a similar repair elsewhere where it just fell off. That worked quite well.

Perhaps I'll take a casting first, then try to prize it off.

thanks

Robert

Reply to
RobertL

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