concealed door closer fitting

I am considering fitting a concealed type door closer, on a lightweight internal living room door. I notice the room is warmer with the door closed or almost closed, but often it is left wide open. Its the type which fits at the hinge edge of the door, completely hidden when the door is closed and uses a chain and spring to pull the door closed, but I have never seen one in action.
Are they any good? Is the 'pull' adjustable? Does the long part with the spring fit in the frame or the door? How long is the spring pocket/ how deep would the drill need to go?
If the spring side fits in the door, has anyone found a reliable technique for drilling deep into the edge of a door by hand, without bursting through a face due to misalignment of the drill?
A few months ago I replaced 7x internal doors. During drilling for the latch of one, I managed to burst slightly through the face - luckily the damage was completely hidden by the door handle.
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Rising butts may be an easier way?
--
*I didn't say it was your fault, I said I was blaming you.

Dave Plowman snipped-for-privacy@davenoise.co.uk London SW
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On 21/01/2018 14:15, Harry Bloomfield wrote:

>Are they any good? Yes
> Is the 'pull' adjustable? Yes
> Does the long part with the spring fit in the frame or the door? Door
> How long is the spring pocket/ how deep would the drill need to go? IIRC about 100mm. Your door edge is only about 50mm max anyway, the rest is hollow - unless its a solid door LOL!
Had one fitted to our downstairs loo for over 30 years for obvious reasons, brilliant, never had a problem. Kids grew up unscathed but I suppose a *slight* chance an unwary little one may get fingers caught in the door jamb.
Andy
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On Sunday, 21 January 2018 14:15:39 UTC, Harry Bloomfield wrote:

they're universally horrible to live with. Rising butt hinges are much friendlier to use. A diy closer is also possible with hooks, nylon fishing or strimmer line and a weight.
NT
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snipped-for-privacy@gmail.com brought next idea :

Good point, maybe an alternative option.

Not for a living room door though..
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On 21/01/2018 15:08, Harry Bloomfield wrote:

Not going to be "concealed", is it?
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Cheers,
Roger
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On Sunday, 21 January 2018 22:24:44 UTC, Roger Mills wrote:

he's a genius!
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Called a Gib Closer. Not very good if the door is only left slightly open as the power will be reduced. Good for slamming a door that had been left wide open though.
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My thoughts. You really need a proper door closer for this job. Which varies the pressure. You can get one which fit into the floor - but a lot of work to fit.
--
*Few women admit their age; fewer men act it.

Dave Plowman snipped-for-privacy@davenoise.co.uk London SW
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On Sun, 21 Jan 2018 06:54:08 -0800 (PST) snipped-for-privacy@gmail.com wrote:

I made one of those for a workshop door, with bicycle gear cable, a couple of screw eyes and a brick. It worked quite well but would fail occasionally (the door saw a lot of use) dropping the brick, so make sure the resting position of the weight is close to the floor. :-)
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On Monday, 22 January 2018 17:32:24 UTC, Rob Morley wrote:

good point :) Mine didn't need anywhere near that much weight. The necessary weight depends a lot on how far from the hinge it's fixed.
NT
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On Sunday, 21 January 2018 14:15:39 UTC, Harry Bloomfield wrote:

I have several. They are good. And adjustable. The long bit goes in the door. It comes with a little bit of metal with a slot that enables it to be fitted The spring is compressed and the slot fits over the chain holding it in the "open"position. Very heavy doors might need two of them. Screwfix has them.
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Harry Bloomfield explained on 21/01/2018 :

To work around that problem, I'm thinking....
Remove the door, lay it absolutely flat and level, then stick a bubble from a level on a drill, preset so when it shows level, the drill bit is level.
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On Sun, 21 Jan 2018 14:15:35 GMT, Harry Bloomfield wrote:

Start shouting at each other to "close the f'ing door"?

I suspect that the action is very similar to the small exposed type with short spring loaded bar that pushes the door shut. Had one of those got rid of it and fitted a proper, two stage, closer. The problem with the bar type was that the force on the door was fairly constant so just accelerated the door all the time leading to it slamming. If you reduced the force to the point where it didn't slam it couldn't close the door against the brushes on the intumastic strip. Admitedly without the brushes it might have worked without excessive slamming.
The two stage closer quickly shuts the door to about 2" open, catches it, then slowly and quietly closes it. Both rates being independantly adjustable. The gotcha with even a small two stage closer is that it makes the door harder to open.
--
Cheers
Dave.
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On 21/01/2018 17:03, Jim GM4DHJ ... wrote:

why do fire doors have the "middle" hinge rarely in the middle but offset to the top of the door?????
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Guessing, the top of the door is likely to be exposed to more heat during the fire rated period than the bottom.
--
Andrew Gabriel
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snipped-for-privacy@cucumber.demon.co.uk (Andrew Gabriel) wrote in writes:

Turning Moments. The bottom hinge is a fulcrum and bears thrust. The top is under tension so it makes sense to shafe it across 2 hinges.
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