Budget

[Andy Hall]

Ever closer union.... Hmm... I wonder if there is VAT on KY jelly.

This is basically what I said. Childrens clothes do carry VAT, thus techncally complying, but zero rated.

[Frank Erskine]

HEAR HEAR!

[dennis]

Funny how nulabor want to put a carbon tax on but want to remove VAT. The VAT was added as an easy to collect carbon tax, not that it works very well.

[dennis]

I wander what date the thread will end on?

[Man at B&Q]

[e-mail]...

Depends how you measure it.

The one doing 60K is more likely to be doing longer journeys, essential for their livelihood and running the car much more efficiently. Why should they be penalised over the low mileage case that is probably used for short, inefficient (ie more polluting per mile) journeys?

I realised I took the extreme case in my example. Even if you removed VED in a way that was revenue neutral for someone doing, say 12k miles pa, you would still be adding about 60p/litre to fuel and penalising higher mileages ouot of all proportion.

MBQ

[Man at B&Q]

[e-mail]...

Is probably doiong short journeys with a cold engine and causing far more pollution per mile than...

Which implies long journeys at or near to the most efficient rpm.

Because they are polluting more per mile!

MBQ

[Man at B&Q]

You don't really think it will be done in such a way that anyone gains?

MBQ

[Roger]

The message

from "Man at B&Q" contains these words:

Out of all proportion to what?

Restrict the tax on cars to tax on fuel and the tax is automatically in proportion to the pollution regardless of the length of each individual journey or the total mileage.

[Roger]

The message

from "Man at B&Q" contains these words:

It could be designed to be revenue neutral and even if it wasn't it is hard to see how the price of fuel could be loaded to such an extent that all low mileage users of economical cars would lose out.

[dennis]

messagenews: [e-mail]...

If they are doing more MPG then they will pay less per km.

Not according to my maths..

£150 VED / 12000 miles = 1.25p/m assuming the average is 35 mpg = 44p per gallon or about 8p/l assuming the average is 17 mpg = twice the above.

[F]

Two additional points 'for':

- the tax can't be avoided

- the industry that exists to administer tax discs will disappear overnight along with the expense of maintaining it.

[Roger]

The message from F contains these words:

The saving on the collection and enforcement would be substantial but the DVLA would still be required to keep track of cars and drivers so it would make sense for the tax disc to metamorphose into a visible MOT certificate.

[Tony Bryer]

You have got to have some form of registration of vehicles and keepers. The tax disc part of this must be trivial in relation to the rest.

[Dave Plowman (News)]

Think your figures are way out. Say 25 mpg. That's 5.5 miles per litre. So 2182 litres needed for 12,000 miles. 60p a litre extra equals 1309 quid.

[Dave Plowman (News)]

No it wouldn't. New cars would still need to be registered. Change of ownership too - and a database kept up to date. Even those vehicles which pay no VED still have to be registered every year if used on the roads. And even those which aren't if you may wish to return them to the road at some time. (SORN)

[The Natural Philosopher]

messagenews: [e-mail]...

Because they are producing more pollution?

Utter bollocks.

[The Natural Philosopher]

I think we have someone else here who 'doesn't count' Roger..;-)

[The Natural Philosopher]

How ould you tell? yoiu have obviouly been through the 'mo maths, no competition, no knowledge, Nu Laber' school system..;-)

[Roger]

The message from The Natural Philosopher contains these words:

I had ignored his actual figures until Dave pointed the disparity out as it doesn't really matter how much is charged for the fuel, the cost is always in proportion to the mileage. I don't always get my own calculations correct but in this particular case I think B&Q probably meant per gallon. not per litre. It doesn't fit the £30 VED that surfaced earlier in the thread but it would fit my car with £205 VED and

30ish overall consumption. 12000 miles, 400 gallons =£240. (Not exactly neutral). 5000 miles = £100, Saving = £105. That at least would have gone part way to offset the tax rise Bastard Brown and his Darling crony have imposed on me this year.

[The Medway Handyman]

Or a valid insurance certificate.

If you watch those Cops on Camera type Police shows, they often stop cars which the number plate reader & computer show as untaxed only to find a whole new can of worms. many of the drivers are uninsured, banned or in posession of drugs & stolen goods.

I reckon you still need some kind of registration system.