BT NTE5 Wiring

Hi, The pair of wires coming in connects to an old style 52A connection block (
http://www.telephonesuk.co.uk/images/52a.jpg ) and then on to the master socket (NTE5) and then to an extension socket upstairs. The connection block is badly damaged, (off the wall, cover missing, wires becoming detached) and I want it replaced, but it's on the "BT side" of the Master Socket, and therefore I'm not supposed to mess with it. I can't find replacement connection blocks and wondered if there's any issues relating to having 2 Master Sockets on a line? Or should I just bite the bullet and get BT out? (along with the associated fee that I suspect will accompany the call).
Thanks Dan
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If you can do it without bu**ering it up why not move the master socket to the location of the the BT52A and fit a secondary where the master is now.
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This is the type of thing used indoors nowadays... http://cpc.farnell.com/_/77ar/junction-box-77a-6-way-idc/dp/TE05896 These will be punchdown connections.
There's also a version with two screw terminals for the A and B incoming wires and punchdowns for the internal wiring, which I have bought from CPC in the past but I can't find on their website anymore.
There are screw terminal versions too if you aren't happy doing punchdown wiring. Somewhere like Maplin will have a few different types on the shelf.

No, unless you still have old style phones with bells and pulse dialling. I've come across installations where BT have done this.

That's up to you. Check in uk.telecom, but I think their call-out is now well over 100. How confident are you that you can do the wiring without messing up? There's plenty of help available here and in uk.telecom of course.
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Andrew Gabriel
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On 27 Apr, 10:38, snipped-for-privacy@cucumber.demon.co.uk (Andrew Gabriel) wrote:

I'm confident I can sort the wiring myself, but I'd need a screw terminal box as the incoming pair of wires are fairly thick compared to the wires that then go off to the Master.
Thanks for all the advice, Dan
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That would be a BT80A, see pictures on http://www.kitz.co.uk/adsl/btsockets.htm
You could use an entirely screw terminal one, of course, although BT wouldn't do that nowadays.
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On 27 Apr 2009 09:38:40 GMT, Andrew Gabriel wrote:

But this is BT side not customer side. You don't get charged for them to repair a faults on their plant. This box is their plant. They may say there is no "fault" and that as "you have damaged the box" you should pay but this to my mind (as currently described by the OP) is wrong.
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Dave.




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You are now charged for repairing damage on your premises, even if you didn't do it. This is down to OpenReach being a separate business, and their staff are instructed to recover all costs.
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On 27 Apr 2009 11:24:39 GMT, Andrew Gabriel wrote:

Bar stewards, how long has that been in?
I think one of the screws may work loose 'cause the box is floating about on the cabling instead of being fixed. This will cause a crackles and noise... I guess a bolshy engineer could still say the problem stems form the damage but plyed with beverage of choice and chocolate biscuits may well not play that card.
Still it is a simple DIY job with easyly obtainable parts. It may also pay the OP to revise any ADSL/filters/extensions on the installation as well.
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Since not long after OpenReach was formed, but the actual implementation/enforcement was more gradual as they changed mentality to being a separate business from BT.
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My 91 y/o MIL had a "Continuous Engaged" fault caused by a faulty (BT branded) walkabout 'phone. An engineer was summoned, unplugged the walkabout base unit, whereupon the fault disappeared. The subsequent bill was £160. Polite requests to BT to waive the bill on the grounds that my MIL is 91 and cannot be expected to grovel on the floor unplugging telephones were equally politely ignored. I wrote to my MILs MP and the bill was subsequently retracted. (Or rather, since she had already paid it, credited to her account, which given her level of phone use, the credit will outlive her.)
And before anyone suggests it, attempts to give her an "easy use" cellular phone to use in emergencies have failed miserably. Twice.
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On 30 Apr 2009 10:26:34 GMT, Huge wrote:

Instruments are still listed in the BT Price List so MIL could rent one from BT which should put the ball back in their court. Their kit is faulty, their problem to correct/replace at their cost. Not a particularly cheap option mind at 5 to 10/month. Visit by nice SIL would be cheaper and nicer for MIL. B-)
At 91 is she still capable of looking after herself and home 100%? No weekly home help for cleaning or a carer to assist with a bathing or morning/night to get to and from bed? Pretty damn impressive if so, or just pig stubborn in not accepting assistance.
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Well, 97.5%, certainly. We go round every 2 or 3 weeks (it's a 3 hour round trip) and I do odd jobs for her.

Mostly the former. I hope I'm in such good nick in my 70's, never mind 90's.
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On Mon, 27 Apr 2009 02:07:29 -0700 (PDT), Dan wrote:

Precisely it's BT side it's their problem and cost to repair/replace.

There are modern equivalents, the sheds have 'em but they will probably be IDC rather than screw. But this is BT side it's not your problem ring them up and report it they should fix it for free.
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Dave.




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BT are not required to carry out free repairs when their equipment is damaged by the occupier (as it sounds like here, albeit possibly a previous one). This would be a chargeable repair.
To the o/p, this should be a simple DIY repair, just needing you to find a suitable screw terminal junction box. Plenty showing on a search for telephone junction box screw terminal, some at TLC & Maplin.
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Some thoughts from our experience two years ago on moving house, and opening a new BT account - we had a cable phone account at the last house.
Arrive at house - slightly noisy line - on inspection find overhead line to corroded j/box on cable, to elderly Post Office Telephones j/box on entry to the house, connected to a veritable rats nest of internal extensions.
Phone BT to request that the line be brought up to a reasonable noise free state, and that a new master socket be fitted - me to deal with internal wiring. BT operative would not agree a no-fee visit, even if the work was on BTs side. Agreed in the end that "the engineer would inspect and tell me if the job was chargeable"
Engineer arrives, agrees problems, runs new cable from gable to new master socket on entry. Without being asked connects one internal extension to the master socket - see later for implications. No mention of costs. Leaves. Time on site less than 90 mins. I assume that is a job done.
One week later a bill for 274 arrives. Spend a good part of the day arguing with BT callcentre bods. Final conclusion - bill reduced to 5.60 - cost of the new master socket.
Lessons are:
Be clear that the work needed is entirely on the BT side of the master socket.
It helps if you can hear analogue noise on the line - this could well be "intermittent" ie you hear it, but it is "gone" when the engineer is there.
DO NOT let the engineer connect ANY of your own wiring after the master socket - this makes the job at least partly chargeable.
If you get a silly bill afterward ARGUE. I found other people had the same experience, and I wonder if there is an unofficial charging policy, with refunds if the subscriber argues. Convenient way of getting the subscriber to pay for BTs infrastructure upgrades.....
We moved away from BT in our last house when an alternative became available, some 20 years ago, because of BTs unhelpful behaviour at the time. I assumed, when on moving we had no choice but to rejoin them, that they would have got better in the interval. But, same old, same old!
Best of luck,
Charles F
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Dan wrote:

As others have said, moving the master socket and installing a slave where the existing master is will be the better solution if it is practical, and you have at least three wires between the two locations. (I you have broadband, then it's best to have the master socket where your router is, ad then fit a filtered faceplate, like they have here http://www.solwise.co.uk/adsl_splitters.htm
Otherwise, a simple junction box with screw terminals on at least one side.
Whenever I need any official BT stuff, I just ask a BT engineer next time I see one in a van, they have always just given me a master socket or junction box without even suggesting I should be touching it myself :-)
It helps having a main distribution cabinet outside my house, as they seem to be at it quite often!
Toby...
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My anecdote relating how you might not get what you want:
A 1980's estate development house in the Birmingham area with BT - 2 line capacity cable arriving via underground ducting to a 'cavity' in the lounge wall covered by a plastic plate type 67AM. There was probably originally a tagstrip in the cavity but later replaced by individual compression connector buttons. The previous owner had utilised both lines, each terminated in master sockets type LJU2/1A located in different rooms in the house. This was not very satisfactory as it was intended to completely redecorate the house and remove the old unnecessary wiring.
There was also considerable noise on the line due to corrosion in compression connectors in the wall cavity eventually it became unusable, meaning a BT call out as it was on their side of the master socket.
I wanted to ensure that when the BT engineer came he terminated the line in a new NTE5 type box where the cable came into the house so that BT's responsibility ended there and the obsolete wiring to the master socket in the bedroom could be replaced. But this did not happen.
The BT engineer flatly refused to fit a type NTE5 line box at the cable entry point or anywhere, and we are still stuck with the old master socket in the bedroom. All that was done was to replace a couple of the connector buttons in the hole in the wall.
I had been under the impression that it in the light of the demarcation of responsibilities, fitting of a line box type NTE5 or similar was current requirement, but it turns out BT have no obligation to fit a such a line box if they can't be bothered.
When the bill came, BT attempted to charge over one hundred pounds for the visit even though the fault was all on their side.
The moral of this tale is that its best to get on with it and do it yourself. Calling out BT in the Birmingham area was the worst thing we could have done.
Roger R
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My experience of a problem is more satisfactory. Previous occupant had extended old style BT sockets to allow for broadband. All very messy, main socket hanging from the wall, cables exposed etc etc. BT initially wanted to charge for putting it right, but as my son receives Disability Living Allowance (and lives with us) BT have a policy of not charging for repairs when there is someone with a disability living there. I don't like taking advantage of his disability, but the rules are there - so no charge for us!
Matt
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