Bosch dishwasher problems....

[Adrian Brentnall]

Hi All We treated ourselevs to a dishwasher last year - a Bosch Exxcel. It worked fine for just over a year - but now it's playing up.

Although it seems to actually wash thing reasonably well - glasses and cutlery are left with a 'grey-white' film - which is slightly greasy to the touch.

Originally we ran the dishwasher with 'tablets' only (we thought that this was OK...) Since then we've tried adding salt and rinse aid - but we still have problems with this 'film' after washing. We use well-water in the house...

I've taken the machine apart as far as I dare - taken off the rotating arms and checked that they are clear, also cleaned out the filters in the base of the machine.

The one thing I've not yet checked is the filter in the water inlet (according to the instruction book there bay be one fitted as part of the inlet pipe).

Can anybody suggest what the next step should be - preferably not calling an an engineer !

How do you get at the innards of the machine in order to look for further blockages - do you need to get at the underside of the machine to do this ??

Many thanks in advance Adrian Suffolk UK ======return email munged================= take out the papers and the trash to reply

[Bob Eager]

You may have added salt, but have you adjusted the lever that controls salt dosage? This is (on my Bosch) on the rim of the salt 'filler' hole. If this is set to minimum, it won't use the salt at all.

[doozer]

Our DW broke down while under warranty and I was lucky enough to be in when the guy came to fix it and have someone who was willing to give me a bit of a lesson on dishwashers at the same time. As most DW seem to be pretty similar these days you probably get into it thus:

Grab loads + loads of old rags place rags on the floor all over where you are going to work and have more on standby pull out DW turn upside down run round frantically mopping up the water that pours out of it (there is apparently a reservoir on the side). unscrew bottom cover be amazed at how little is in there. fiddle with innards

[Adrian Brentnall]

Hmmm - I looked at the manual - it seems that the water softener feature is controlled by holding down a particular front panel button while switching the dishwasher on.

The manual claims that you can set values for salt from 0 to 7 (by repeated presses of a front panel button) - but I can only seem to get

0 or 1.

Was set to 0 - now set to 1 - so we'll see if that makes any difference...?

Thanks for the pointer Adrian

======return email munged================= take out the papers and the trash to reply

[Adrian Brentnall]

HI Graham Thanks for the comments

Aha - I see it involved 'technical stuff' Another poster kindly suggested that I turn on the water softener feature - so we'll see if that makes any difference....

Many thanks Adrian

======return email munged================= take out the papers and the trash to reply

[Andrew Gabriel]

I would run one of the dishwasher cleaners in the machine (empty). There seems to be some type of grease which the dishwasher detergent doesn't touch, which slowly builds up in the machine. Ordinary washing up liquid does however dissolve this, and the dishwasher cleaner will probably remove it. Having had this happen with a few dishwashers in the family, I have found that a couple of drips of washing up liquid added to the wash stops it from happening in the future (and I do mean just a couple of drops -- one member of the family put a large squirt in, with the result that the kitchen filled up ankle deep in foam before anyone noticed;-).

[<rde42]

The point is that if the water softener isn't operating (and your water isn't soft to start with) you *will* get the clouding. I once forgot to recharge the salt and got exactly that. The salt is what makes the water softener work (althiugh that's a slight simplification).

The number it's set to will depend on the hardness of the water in your area. The water company can tell you the figure, and the manual will tell you the corresponding number to use. Ours is settable 0-5, and we are on 3...

[Adrian Brentnall]

Aha - I see.....

Hmm - can't seem to get any options other than 0 & 1....... although the Manual suggests that 0 - 7 are possibilities. I've just emailed Bosch to see what they have to say on the matter..........

Thanks for the info Adrian

======return email munged================= take out the papers and the trash to reply

[Adrian Brentnall]

Ah - that seems to fit with the scenario..... I did have a look in Tescos this morning - but couldn't see anything called 'dishwasher cleaner'...... any brand names, please ??

Lovely mental picture I'll try that then - with the water softener turned 'on' and a quick dribble of washing up liquid.

Btw - the 'film' on the glass & cutlery does appear to come off with 'manual' washing - but that's kind of not the reason you've got a dishwasher, is it ??

I've emailed Bosch for comments - I'll feed back anything constuctive that they say to the group.....

Thanks Adrian

======return email munged================= take out the papers and the trash to reply

[Andrew Gabriel]

"Finish" certainly used to do one. It's about the size of a large pill bottle, and you stand it upside down in the cutlery basket. I think when the dishwasher gets up to temperature, a plug in the lid melts, and the cleaner liquid runs out. It's a long time since I've needed to use one though.

[Adrian Brentnall]

OK - I'll look out for that. Prelimary tests look promising - but can't really tell until tomorrow when we've got some daylight again....... I tried your trick with the 'fairy' liquid, also used a different type of dishwasher tablet (instead of the Tesco cheapie one) - and I think I've got the water softener running now.....

...way too many things all changed at the same time ! Where's your scientific methods boy ....??!

Ah well - we'll see what daylight brings

Thanks for your help so far Adrian ======return email munged================= take out the papers and the trash to reply

[TheTaffia]

I have recently bought this same (Bosch Excel) D'washer, I seem to remember having trouble getting the softner level right because all I got was the 0/1 option you mentioned above. After closer inspection of the manual, it seems that I was holding in the wrong button when switching the machine on, because the pic in the manual is not clear. I don't have the manual with me now but if you hold down the one to the immediate right (or left!) you'll get the option to increase the softner setting between 0-7.

[Adrian Brentnall]

You know - you're right. The button immediately to the right of the one shown in the manual does have a range of 0 - 7. Was set to 4 - so have upped it to 7....

If the manual can be believed - the 0 / 1 button controls the 'intensive drying function' which 'increases the temperature during the rinse-aid stage and gives better results'.......

It's bad enough actually needing to _read_ the Manual - but when it contains duff info as well......!!

I did a trial run this morning (before reading your post) - using a branded dishwasher tablet rather than tesco's own, and with the 'intensive drying' on - and it seems to have cleaned the crud off a bunch of (already dishwashed 'clean') glasses and cutlery - so perhaps we're making progress.....

I thought the Germans did things properly - though having worked with Siemens for a while a few years ago, maybe I'm wrong to think that ! Long story....

Thanks again Adrian

======return email munged================= take out the papers and the trash to reply

[PeterK]

I'm probably jumping in with both feet here but here goes. I've recently experienced a white deposit on glasses but primarily stainless stell cutlery. I've cured it but don't know the cause as will be shown below.

Siemens dishwasher 2/3 years old. It came with a water test kit - can't for the life of me remember what it was but we've never used salt & rinse aid in the washer.

1st incident: Started using tablets guess about 18 mnths ago 2nd incident Washer heating water to luke warm only - traced to dry joint (caused through overheating ) on the control panel electronics - common fault. Also discovered that 2 italian companies (with web sites) seem to make 99% of the components in dishwashers and ther function and spec. of every component can be found and you can diagnose a Siemens dishwasher fault using a Goldstar service manual from a South African web site

With hindsight I wonder at this stage do tablets work as well as powder and if the dishwasher was failing to heat up was I getting "fat" deposits in the "plumbing"

Now start getting the white deposit. Endure this for 3 weeks and try powder - deposits reduced but is it a coincidence?

3rd Incident Note that dishwasher is failing to empty at the end of the cycle and the water is "grey" - hardly a clean rinse. Problem gets worse so have to bail out the dishwasher and get to the pump impeller underwater - unable to confirm a blockage but enough debris to guess yes there was .

Dishwasher now ok & no deposits

So: did the could the use of tablets or low temperatures cause a build up of partly "dissolved" fat. Then did the rise in wash temperature cause these deposits to "come out in the wash"? Did these deposits cause a blockage that stopped the dishwasher emptying? Through not emptying properly did the deposits remain in the machine?

Don't know the answers , haven't answered Adrian's post, just "fattied" the waters - time to go I think?

[Pete C]

This site is worth a look:

cheers, Pete.

[Adrian Brentnall]

Thanks for the link - very interesting. Sounds as if we ought to be using a separate 'detergent-only' chemical

- as we are now using additional salt and rinse aid.....

Many thanks Adrian ======return email munged================= take out the papers and the trash to reply

[Bob Eager]

The (not often understood) point is that the salt is not used to soften the water. It's used to recharge the water softener built into the dishwasher. Salt in the tablets doesn't even get into the right part of the machine.

We use Tesco own brand dishwasher powder, and separate salt. The powder is cheaper than tablets, and the salt costs peanuts.

[Andy Hall]

Ah but...... Is it perhaps that the manufacturers of said tablets use the term "salt" to describe the water softening agent (Sodium Metaphosphate possibly) that is incorporated in them because they feel that most customers are below the level of knowledge and IQ to know what the latter is?

[Pete C]

Whatever it is, it's a very profitable way to sell water softener. I'd expect it gets the dishes clean, though I'm not sure it softens enough to stop the machine getting clagged up.

I use liquid gel detergent, makes it possible to wash plastic stuff without it getting 'sandblasted'.

cheers, Pete.