Water Heater Drainage

[James]

On Wed, 5 Feb 2014 19:53:10 -0600, micky wrote (in article ):

Yeah there is a plastic drain pipe on the side of the pan. Missed seeing it due to its position.

[James]

On Thu, 6 Feb 2014 19:01:08 -0600, Oren wrote (in article ):

Yup. All in the same closet. Will post pics. Not sure what you mean about original thread :/ I accidently posted a new thread with the same topic. Argh.

[James]

On Wed, 5 Feb 2014 19:37:42 -0600, James wrote (in article ):

Here are pics

[micky]

So ruin a garden hose to an outside room and run it out the window. If the end is below the bottom of the water heater, it will siphon out almost the last little bit of water, which might be bad if there is a lot of sediment. So don't go so low . If the end of the hose is 2 inches above the bottom of the WH, it will stop siphoning when the water in the WH is 2 inches above the bottom.

If you don't want the water to pour down to the ground outside, get a second hose and put a funnel in the mouth of it and let the first hose drain into the funnel. That will break the vacuum stop the siphoning at the level of the exit of the first hose, wherever that is. Hold everything to your window with some strings. Kite string is fine.

[micky]

Where does it go? If it goes nowhere, you can still put a garden hose in it and tape it up with duck tape for draining, and run it to the window.

Don't open up the drain spigot so much that the hose can't handle it, the water rises to the top of the lip.

Or you can put the garden hose right on the threaded spigot.

Why do you want to drain the WH. Everyone here says not to do so, because the spigot will get clogged. I've never done it, in 31 years here.

[micky]

There's not supposed to be a connection between the "spout" and the hole. Water falls out of the spout, starrts to fill the pan, and then runs out of the pan.

There's supposed to be a connection between the hole and a drain or a sump. .

[micky]

People, and vendors, are always trying to improve our standard of living. Even if men don't care, women don't like it when every 20 years there is 40 or 50 gallons of water on the floor.

What do you care if there is sediment on the bottom? It only matters if the sediment is so deep it starts to surround the lower electric heating element. Do you even have an electric WH? Or gas?

Assume it's electric. I have that too. When I, probably mistaking thermostat or element problems for something more serious, junked my 8yo WH. I cut it open and there was less than 2 tablespoons of sediment. At that rate it would have taken over 80 years for the sediment to reach the heating element.

Water varies by location. You need to talk to your neighbors and find out if they ever drain the WH, how often and how much sediment comes out. Some of them don't drain it, that's for sure. How long do their WH's last. In the 10 years I've been reading, no one in this group has ever reported good results from draining the WH, curing an existing problem without creating a bigger problem. What they say often happens is sediment gets in the drain valve, the pressure and flow are not enough to flush the sediment out, and the valve won't shut tight anymore and is always dripping hot water and the WH has to be replaced.

Why?

When it leaks it will drain itself. Why do you need to drain it before then?

[micky]

How high is the drain pan?

How high is the spigot?

How much bigger than the diameter of the WH is the diameter of the pan, where the spigot is? EVen if the hose goes down at first and then UP to go over the pan lip, as long as the end of the hose is lower than the water level in the WH, the WH will drain.

But why do you want to drain it? What problem do you hope to solve?

Everyone here says that's a way to get sediment in your spigot so it won't close anymore.

[James]

On Thu, 6 Feb 2014 20:30:08 -0600, Oren wrote (in article ):

I wasn't referring to you about the snide remark. It was the poster who said something about my IQ. Sorry I should have clarified that. If draining is not necessary unless the unit fails then I won't bother with it. The hot water supply has been a little wonky lately though, kinda small sporadic interruptions in the flow but nothing serious.

Thanks for the advice about a ball valve. I will certainly use it when the time comes.

[James]

On Thu, 6 Feb 2014 20:44:35 -0600, Oren wrote (in article ):

Oh I see. Didn't quite understand what the bib part was. Thought it was the entire spout assembly.

[trader4]

In what you're replying to he's talking about a *permansent* connection to the drain pain in case it leaks, not about draining the water heater. So a hose out the bedroom window doesn't sound like a viable solution. And he cant't get a garden hose on the bibb to begin with, that was the intitial question, because it's too close to the floor and the pan lip is in the way.

[trader4]

From what he's described, it doesn't go anywhere. He's apparently talking about just the fact that the drain pan has the connection on it to connect it to some drain if you choose to connect it.

If it goes nowhere, you can still put a garden hose

Duck tape? In a closet in a living space that also has the washer and dryer it it? Sounds like a prscription for disaster. If he wants to do that, he can surely make up the proper pipe connections to attache a garden hose to the pan. And if he has a lower point to route it to, it will work. Thes siphoning part I'm not too keen on as you'd have to somehow pefectly manage the flow rate out of the heater to equal the siphoning rate. If it draws air, he has to start all over.

Plus, I believe he indicated that the reason he wanted to drain it was to flush it. In which case, the pan thing is useless, because you want full force water coming out to wash the sediment out.

See above.

Did you even read the original question? Look at the pic?

I believe he indicated it was so he could periodically flush it.

[trader4]

The bibb is what you'd call the "spout assembly". Many of them today are plastic, it looks like yours is bronze, which is better.

[trader4]

All those questions have been addressed, he even posted pics.

[Stumpy]

I flush my gas water heater once a year. I don't drain it, but leave supply on full and open the drain valve full to a hose going out a door to an exterior sidewalk. I see ~1/2 cup of white mineral chips spread out on the sidewalk when I'm done. In a gas heater I assume that the chips would have remained on the bottom of the tank and slowed heat transfer to the water mass. When I have a faucet aerator with reduced flow, I pull it off and find those same white chips clogging the screen. My municipal system gets the tail end of the Colorado river before we send it into Mexico, so the dissolved solids can be very high at the end of the summer.

[micky]

I don't think he is.

But he knows better than you or I what he wants. He can surely figure out if my answer is a "viable solution". It's good of you to pre-read and pre-think for him, but I don't think he needs the help.

That wasn't the issue in the immediately preceding posts.

[trader4]

See, that's why you're wandering in the wilderness. You can't follow a thread:

Another poster:

Me:

James (OP):

And from that you don't think that we're talking about the permanent type of drain connection you have with many of these pans? He's said that the pan has a drain fitting, but it's not connected to anything. Good grief.

You dumb ass, he told you what he has and what the question is. He even posted a pic. And he further clarified that he was interested in draining it for routine flushing maintenance. And here you are 2 days and 30 posts later not understanding that the problem is he wants to drain the water heater and that with the location of the bibb and pan lip, he can't get a hose on it. Further, just draining it into the pan with your siphoning arrangement, aside from being impractical, I don't think is going to accomplish anything in terms of flushing it, to get deposits out. When I've done that, draining it didn't do much at all. You had to have the drain wide open and cycle the cold water full on and off, stirring it up. And even then it took a long time and a lot of water to get to the point where white particles were no longer coming out. I don't see how he's going to do that with your siphon idea. But, hell, I guess I should just shut up and let folks who can't even follow the quetion asked, the context, or the thread give solutions that would be a waste of his time.

Do try to pay attention. It was clearly the only problem that he asked about, starting in the very first post.

[James]

On Fri, 7 Feb 2014 09:37:07 -0600, micky wrote (in article ):

Very good points. I do not intend to waste time doing anything I don't need to that may make things worse. I lived in another house near where I live now (same water supply). Sediment was pretty bad in that home's w/h but I do not know how long the w/h was sitting before I drained it. IIRC there was about 2 cups of crap in it. Luckily the valve didn't leak when I was done. Could have replaced it if it did I suppose.

I see your point. But if it starts leaking just a little bit I won't have the time to power it off, shut off the supply and babysit it until it drains out by itself without a hose. Now if it suddenly starts leaking a quart a minute and I am away then I will have bigger problems (I'm exaggerating of course). I just wanted to see if there was a way to get a hose on it without tearing up the pan or causing other problems. I won't drain it just for the sake of doing it if it's really not needed.

[James]

On Fri, 7 Feb 2014 09:19:38 -0600, micky wrote (in article ):

Very good advice. I hadn't thought of that. Sometimes the easiest things to do aren't entirely obvious to me. As I've explained, I thought periodic draining of a w/h was important. This is the first time anyone has ever said otherwise and there are good reasons not to, apparently. Hope we can put this thread to rest now :)

[trader4]

One thing I would do. Given that the WH is in a closet, I would get two of those $10 battery water alarms that they have at HD, etc. Put one in the WH pan and the other one by the washing machine that's also there. They have contacts on the bottom and the alarm goes off from water. Since the pan is metal, you'll have to put a piece of plastic or similar on the bottom for it to sit on.

BTW, another thought came to mind. We talked about the pan having a drain connection. Is that at least closed off? I don't remember from the pic. If not, I would tend to that too. With it closed off, at least the pan will hold 2" of water or so. It should have a pvc fitting that you can cap off or whatever.