water conditioners...do they work?

Hello.

We wanted to look at a water softener but our home is fully finished and the plumbing is not accessable. I have to soften all lines in the home, there is no way to isolate the kitchen sink or other drinking water lines. We do not want to drink/cook with softwater. And we don't see the value in plumbing the hot side only.

So, any comments on water conditioners? I came across these guys

formatting link
and many more for that mater. Are they for real, do they actually work?

Any comments are appreciated. Thanks.

Reply to
Freddy
Loading thread data ...

Because of the added sodium? No facts or figures but I am reasonably sure you'd get more sodium in one slice of pizza or small can of V8 than you would by drinking gallons of softened water. _____________

Ask for customers' names and check with them. Or independant lab/university tests. And ask if they also sell that stuff to put in the gas tank so you can use water instead of gasoline.

Reply to
dadiOH

I would be very skeptical that this unit would work - even consider it a fraud. To soften water you have to preform some chemistry which is replacing calcium with sodium. Those on low salt diets would be better off drinking hard water.

Reply to
Frank

on 1/3/2008 10:21 AM Freddy said the following:

A softener can be installed between the water source and the cold water inlet of the water heater. That way, only the hot water is softened. Softened water also helps to reduce scale buildup in the WH.

Reply to
willshak

If you buy one, it does work. It is very effective at removing unwanted money from suckers.

Reply to
Bob F

There's some interesting reading on this and similar scams at

formatting link

Reply to
Doug Miller

Nice site. I am, myself, a retired chemist and am constantly amazed at the fraud put over on the technically ignorant.

Also recently let my plumber test my water and he wanted to put in a water softener based on the results. I read them too and decided I did not need it.

Frank

Reply to
Frank

Ha...yes because of the sodium, and i assume it would also alter the taste of coffee or anything else for that matter....

Reply to
Freddy

Thanks, yup, but most homes use 2/3 cold water ,or more, then hot. We just don't see the benifits for hot only for the expense.

Reply to
Freddy

Great. That is what i want to hear. :)

Reply to
Freddy

Change "gallons" to "a gallon" and you'll be pretty close, I think.

Hard water may contain 100mg per liter of calcium or more

formatting link
it's conceivable that completely softened water may have in the neighborhood of 200+mg of sodium per liter (it takes two sodium ions to replace one calcium ion), or, very roughly, 750mg per gallon.

Coffee made with soft water is horrible, just awful. It makes pretty lousy tea, too. And it's bad for plants.

Reply to
Doug Miller

It's sodium, not salt. I can taste no difference but our water wasn't crushingly hard to begin with. One thing sure, the softened water has a more neutral taste than the unsiftened because the iron/sulfur taste is gone too.

Reply to
dadiOH

my dad uses a softener in phoenix, drinking water is run thru a osmosis water purifier to remove salt like substances and off tastes. my dad has high blood pressure and cant have added salt.........

its supposed to be very effective, and their fixtures dont get scungy deposits.

although showering in soft water feels slimy, they say you get used to it

Reply to
hallerb

Doug,

What you seem to be saying is that softened water may contain between 0 and 200 mg. of sodium per liter I'm ok with that. Then say that softened water makes bad coffee but you don't tells us whether it's the sodium and how much sodium concentration makes the coffee bad. That doesn't work for me. I have a softener because my water contains about 35 gpg of hardness, probably calcium. I do make coffee and tea with the softened water. It's fine for this, in my opinion. The unsoftened water makes terrible tea, there's a precipitate. Explain how much sodium is required to produce your bad coffee. My experience argues that some sodium is ok.

Dave M.

Reply to
David L. Martel

We don't have any problem with it, and if we did we'd just use 50=A2 gallon distilled water (I'd use distilled anyway, like I used to, but I'm not The Boss of me anymore). -----

- gpsman

Reply to
gpsman

If you're on a sodium-restricted diet, you might not be ok with that.

I don't know, and I really don't care, whether it's the presence of sodium, or the absence of calcium, or the phase of the moon or whatever that makes soft-water coffee taste like crap. Soft water makes awful coffee. In my opinion. Don't believe me? Try it yourself. Don't agree with me? Enjoy it. Just don't invite me over for coffee, ok?

I have no idea. If you like it, fine. But I won't be having coffee at your house.

Reply to
Doug Miller

Doug,

But I'm not and if I were I'd consult with a physician. Perhaps he'd recommend using KCl instead of NaCl. Don't know if KCl makes bad coffee or tea though.

You need to read the whole post before you begin firing off your retort. As my post makes clear I do make both coffee and tea with softened water and I've received no complaints.

Don't agree with me? Enjoy it.

I do. So do my guests.

Dave M.

Reply to
David L. Martel

Or maybe they're just too polite to tell you. :-)

Reply to
Doug Miller

We don't have any problem with it, and if we did we'd just use 50¢ gallon distilled water (I'd use distilled anyway, like I used to, but I'm not The Boss of me anymore). -----

Unless you are taking a battery of mineral supplements, you should NOT drink distilled water.

Reply to
<h>

If you have more than 3-4 gpg of hardness in your water, you&#39;ll spend more money to heat water, replace water heaters and/or electric elements and other water using appliances and to wash and replace clothes and fixtures that will wear out prematurely etc. than to buy a softener and maintain it. Of course that means you don&#39;t pay gobs more bucks for it than you could have.

All the water used in the house should be treated, not just the water heater cold feed. And there should not be a hard water line run to the kitchen sink, or toilets etc.. The people that think they get a benefit out of drinking hard water need to look up how much water they&#39;d have to drink to get any benefit from the minerals in it. And drinking too much water will kill you.

The added sodium caused by ion exchange softening, if using softener salt instead of potassium chloride (salt substitute) which is not as efficient as &#39;salt&#39; because all cation softening resins are made in the sodium form, is 7.85 mg/l (roughly a quart) per gpg of exchange. Thirty five gpg = 274.75 mg/liter (or quart).

Most of us are npt drinking the 8 8oz glasses of water we are supposed to so how many are ingesting a quart of softened water a day?

An 8 oz glass of V8 is like 560 mg of sodium. Same size glass of skim milk, about 530. A slice of white bread, from 120-160 mg. On&#39;n on. Some people could eat a few less chips or other snack foods and drink a gallon or more of their softened water and actually REDUCE their daily sodium intake. But they see all that salt they pour in their salt tank disappear and mistakenly think it all went into their water. It doesn&#39;t. A softener only uses a small amount of the sodium, all the rest and all the chloride goes out the drain line.

People on sodium restricted diets know how to count their daily uptake and can adjust accordingly. Healthy people get much more sodium than the body requires but drinking softened water doesn&#39;t add near as much as some would have us believe.

BTW, all waters contain some sodium to begin with, check your water company&#39;s water quality report or have a sodium test done on your well water and see.

The vast majority of people with water softeners say their coffee and tea tastes better or there is no difference. Hardness (calcium and magnesium) is a small part of all the stuff in the TDS (total dissolved solids) content of a water. They cause taste problems much more easily than hardness does.

Gary Slusser Quality Water Associates

Reply to
Gary Slusser

HomeOwnersHub website is not affiliated with any of the manufacturers or service providers discussed here. All logos and trade names are the property of their respective owners.