Yeah, if it was only one kid I might agree with you, but it wasn't. BTW: Assault can also include violent verbal attacks, which this may have qualified for. You don't have to hit someone to assault them.
And he conveniently forgets that one of the kids also said something about her being so fat that he could stick her with a knife like butter. Is that worthy of conviction for making a terroristic threat? No. But together with the other behavior, since the bus aid obviously was incapable of handling it, it was enough to justify either taking the bus back to school, or to the police or calling the police to the bus, if they refused to stop. And if this was done just once, imagine the effect when all the rest of the similar kids find out what happened.
Imagine what these people would be saying if the incident continued, distracted the driver, and there was a fatal accident. Or if the thugs continued, turning their attention on some other student, and seriously injuring them.
Here is the assault statute for my state (AZ). This assault, if charged, would be under section 3. There is nothing in this statute that fits the verbal abuse that occurred in this case.
13-1203. Assault; classificationA. A person commits assault by:
B. Assault committed intentionally or knowingly pursuant to subsection A, paragraph 1 is a class 1 misdemeanor. Assault committed recklessly pursuant to subsection A, paragraph 1 or assault pursuant to subsection A, paragraph 2 is a class 2 misdemeanor. Assault committed pursuant to subsection A, paragraph 3 is a class 3 misdemeanor.
The kid was commenting on her fat (no wonder), not threatening her with an upcoming stabbing. Even kids use non-literal descriptions in their language. Ever told someone you would kill them in casual conversation? Did you? Did they call the cops on you??
Punish *all* the kids, even the non-participants? Wouldn't it be better just to punish just the bad ones individually? Wouldn't it be even better if the situation didn't occur in the first place because a competent bus monitor had that route under control?
Exactly. If the school had control, the situation would not have happened. You don't really think this situation happened for the very first time the kid decided to record it do you...
Assault does not necessarily include touching at all.
Some people are clueless, but what are you going to do?
Disagree but not entirely.
Yes, but sometimes real life gets in the way so you have to adapt. If the entire bus is punished, the others that are inconvenienced will take care of the bad ones.
Huh? What's that have to do with anything discussed in this thread?
In AZ we can carry concealed, no permit required...
???
Create more student assaults to solve this one??
Not at all. Behavior can be taught in other ways. Pressure can be put on the screw ups not to do what they have been doing. It worked for a few centuries before the ACLU got involved in our lives.
Peer pressure can work both ways.
It's called "corporate punishment," that is, exacting a penalty on the entire group for the misdeeds of one member. The theory is that the group can exert continuing control over the miscreant.
This technique worked for the Roman Legions, it works in the Marine Corps, and it works in the elementary school classroom.
Apparently you have a reading comprehension problem. Condition #3 was met. The kid poked the lady with a finger, clearly with the intent to insult and/or provoke her.
And you don't need an actual crime to occur in order to call the police for help because you think one is about to. A large part of what they do is PREVENT crime. Again, the bus aid was well within her rights to call the police to meet the bus. Or to have the bus driver take the bus load of kids to the police station or back to school to face the principal.
As for the inconvenience to the other kids, well too bad and so what? The inconvenience was being caused by the unruly kids. Similar and far worse happens all the time. What about the inconvenience to me by being pulled over by the police at a roadblock looking for drunks for example? Or the inconvenience to all the passengers on a plane when they have to divert because of one unruly passenger that is out of control and refuses to obey the flight attendents?
Don't know about verbal attacks, but a verbal threat is assault in some states (Florida), as is unwanted touching....
I know that in Florida, a threat is assault. Unwanted touching is battery. Haven't studied the whole statute today, but here it is:
Now the bad kids are being threatened. boo-hoo everyone cry.
A crime was committed before the finger poke. The classic definition of "assault" is "A threat to inflict bodily harm coupled with the immediate ability to carry out that threat." That is, you can't commit an assault over the telephone (no immediacy). "Battery" is the physical part of the altercation.
Woah! The ability of the cops to prevent crime is the thought of what they will do AFTER the crime is committed. The cops have no duty nor authority to prevent any crime.
Given that last statement, it must be a very strange world you live in, devoid of reality.
The reading error is yours. Read up a few paragraphs where I said: "This assault, if charged, would be under section 3.
True.
Agreed. But only if they have some time for routine patrol and are not tied up on unnecessary school bus calls.
You can call the cops for anything. The most recent I heard was the guy who didn't like the way his sandwich was made.
IMO a bad idea. Where you gonna put the kids? The substations in my area have 5 holding cells or less and they were designed for one person.
Perhaps a little better idea, but if I was a parent of an innocent kid, and waited for a school bus that didn't arrive, I would first be in a panic (accident?) and then pissed. I would have made that principals life miserable. Probably me and several more parents.
I was thinking more of the fairness angle.
No it was a *few* unruly kids. And it was by an incompetent school bus monitor that didn't keep order. Kids push. If you don't take control and show them who's boss things deteriorate. That's what happened here.
As I said it's not the inconvenience I was questioning. It was the fairness to the innocent kids, and the parents of the innocent kids. I could have handled those kids. You could have handled those kids. And the school bus monitor *should have* handled those kids. That was the problem.
Or the 3 to 6 times I get stopped by Border Patrol roadblocks on every trip to CA. Necessary inconveniences. Dragging a school bus full of kids to the police station to solve a minor school problem? Unnecessary...
Here in AZ too. We just don't call it an assault.
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13-1202. Threatening or intimidating; classificationA. A person commits threatening or intimidating if the person threatens or intimidates by word or conduct:
B. Threatening or intimidating pursuant to subsection A, paragraph 1 or 2 is a class 1 misdemeanor, except that it is a class 6 felony if:
C. Threatening or intimidating pursuant to subsection A, paragraph 3 is a class 3 felony.
Of course they do. Increase the number of marked cars in a particular beat area and the crime statistics go down. Every time. Unless of course they're often tied up on school bus calls... ;)
AZ also has a statute on intimidation: Threatening or intimidating word or conduct of a nature threatening to cause physical injury or property damage is a criminal offense.
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