OT computer issue

Uhh, no. The only way you're going to swap drives and have the other machine boot instead of bluescreen is either by:

(a) editing registry hive beforehand, removing references to hardware components so that windows will redetect them; The system hive specifically on Windows XP. You don't have to reload your OS if you do this, you're just removing it's record of the hardware present. It'll boot and rebuild the record based on hardware detection it's going to perform.

or

(b) the chipset is a close enough match to the aforementioned registry hive details. It'll boot in this manner as well, but, stability could be an issue down the road. Close enough is a fine line.

It makes no difference retail or oem and doesn't matter about the BIOS either so much. It matters that the hardware the registry hive knows about is a close match to what the machine has at the mainboard level; chipset specifically. It's the price you pay for plug and play based OSes. Hardware detection and a 'record' of what they detected. The record has to either be a close if not outright match at the mainboard level, or, it has to be cleared so the OS can create a new record.

Btw, you can take a single XP disc and swap four files to convert it to retail, oem, or vendor specific. four files determine this; everything else on that disc is identical to the byte.

Stick to your electrical knowledge clare, IT isn't something you're an expert in, clearly.

I have been using an old Dell Latitude W/98 lap top for a server for about 15 years with no problems. I have it sitting up on blocks so it has free air on the bottom but other than that nothing special.

Dell was the offender but the start line on a Dell PS was not #14 so nothing happens when you plug it into another PC and vice versa when you plug a standard PS into a dell.

It's not doing anything that actually keeps it busy for any real length of time, then, right? Mostly idling? Old processor not actually mobile if memory serves, but the same thing a desktop box would be using at the time - which compared to the cpus of today, doesn't run nearly as hot, even if you got it busy to 100% load and left it there. Would you care to share more specs about it?

Windows 98? So.. are you having to reset it once every 49.7 days? Or, did you provide the patch to correct the issue?

You wouldn't seriously suggest someone take a modern laptop and run it as a dedicated server that gets more than very occasional use would you? You should know! the machine isn't built to do that and won't last for too long doing it. Setting aside the point, modern laptops even at 'idle' these days in a confined space are more like a toaster oven than that old Latitude.

I get the impression it's essentially a small file server for other computers on your network? Do you still have netbios binded to TCP/IP? If so, you might want to alter the configuration so it's not. While it's unlikely someone is going to breach your router's firewall, the possibility does exist and, you wouldn't want to make the win98 box easy pickings in that event.

You're incorrect, but, don't take my word for it. See here:

Dell wasn't the only one to have pulled this nonsense either.. to their credit. HP/Compaq (before Compaq became HP) did it too. pbell was notoriously bad about things like this. Had to be extremely careful with them.

Ouch. Do you atleast have a certification under your belt, or, are you one of those shady tree mechanic types? Don't get me wrong, some shady tree mechanics do a fine job of working on and upgrading some of my older vehicles. But, if I had something 'new' that was decked out with sensors and multiple ECMs, I wouldn't be taking it to them. Not when I have to show them how to use the modern devices that let them talk to the cars computer, anyhow. Otherwise, they've done great service work for me.

I've got just over twenty something years (going from 18years old) doing it professionally, myself. By professional, I actually mean certifications, etc and real world, hands on experience in the trade. Not that of shady tree style, either. If i'm putting my name on it, it's going to be tight, it's going to be right.

At one point, during my schooling in Maine, we had a test known as the BEAM test. Several new england states participated in it, once per year. It consisted of 100 questions concerning different aspects of the PC. You were graded on the amount of questions you got right as well as the time it took you to do it. I scored first place, both years I took the test. Not for my state mind you, but for the entire geographical area. First place.

Had I known what my 'sending' school had in mind for me, I would have skipped class both times. I didn't appreciate being paraded in front of the student body to accept an award for essentially being a computer geek. It wasn't 'cool' then to know much about a PC...

Nor did I appreciate various news media outlets being present to film the award ceremony. I had no idea this was the result of doing well the first time I took it. The second time, due to the flu, I wasn't present for them to do that to me. I got the paper when I returned to school. :)

I began 'piddling' around age 5. before PC was a common thing to be found in your household. Apple II (green screen) and later, my first computer that I actually owned; tandy color computer three. (the last in the Coco family) My first PC was actually a Tandy 3000NL powered by an Intel x86 286 (10megahertz) I ran a BBS from it; Spitfire. Using nothing more than a single high density 1.44meg floppy disk. That was the same disc used to boot the computer, btw. It averaged roughly 30 or so callers per day, which wasn't bad considering the tiny town (New Gloucester, Maine) I lived in at the time. Ever since then though, I've owned (as in paid for) monster clones I bought myself. I do own a few name brand laptops, though. But, they were given to me. or, I traded 'computer time' (Ie: I fixed something they owned) for one- Which was a good deal for them because something was wrong with the laptop and they were going to junk it anyhow. [g]

I wouldn't actually use any of them to run say a web server that actually gets visitors, or, an sql server that actually gets queries for any real length of time though. I'd be concerned about premature hardware failure due to overheating and abuse. They are laptops, not designed to be 24/7 machines. Portability is a trade off.

I must have because it runs for a year or more at a time and the boot is just because I am doing something else.

I doubt anyone on alt.home.repair is hitting any server that hard.

It is tougher than just cracking the DSL router address translation here.

They still never explained how they got the PS started. The start line was on a dead voltage pin. I do know I have plugged a Dell supply into an IBM board and it did absolutely nothing.

Are you sure? I'm a user of this newsgroup and my servers are pounded on a routine basis on this LAN. They aren't laptops, though. :)

Oh.. wait, DSL.. lol... that's another beastie and not anywhere near as secure as you probably think it is. Do you have WPS enabled? Are you using the modem/router combo your ISP provided you? Which make/model might it be?

How's that? It's pin 11 on some older Dells, where as the standard is pin #14, you'll also notice, pins 1-3 is 5volts for a Dell, and 3.3 for a standard configuration. The 12 volt pins, positive and negative were changed from standard configuration too; so it most certainly would toast the board and/or PSU and possibly other components attached to the mainboard.

Pin #14 on a non standard Dell was common (negative) not positive, so it would look dead if you just did a quick check with a multimeter. On the standard ATX pin out, it's PS start. Short to any negative (or common) and the PS will usually fire up. Unless it expects to see a load, then it may not remain on but it will initially fire.

You will have to keep the connection established to keep the PSU going, though. Disconnecting once it powers up will cause the PSU to turn back off; although it's not really off in the true sense of the word, as it's ATX.

You lucked out, then. The only reason it couldn't start the power supply was because the PS hot line was never connected to ground in the configuration they used. Had it been, and anything else wasn't standard, you'd have toasted it. No going back, no starting over. Magic smoke would have been released and you know how that goes. You can't feed a 5volt circuit 12 volts (possibly reverse polarity) and not expect something bad to happen. There's no 'stupid user safety' circuit like you'd find in a mobile CB radio. IE: no diode to go pop if you reversed polarity by accident.

I see. So, you weren't actually what we'd call a bench technician or a 'tech in the trenches' so to speak. That would explain why you didn't know about the pin configuration differences... It's not something someone in your field would expect to be dealing with.

Everything was pretty much the same in your world, replace parts as needed, possibly modify a configuration file if needbe. Am I close? I'm not trying to be condescending nor rude with you.

Well, do be careful piddling around. :) And congrats on living to see retirement. I hope it's a good experience for you!

I tried a standard atx power supply on a Dell and it didn't do anything., untill a few wires were moved in the connector. Don't try to just move the start wire.

For the past 15 yrs Dell has used a standard ATX P/S. ('96-'00 was non-standard)

It was those non-standard late nineties that had me coining the phrase "Dell from Hell" - because back then they WERE "from hell" Unlike Apple, who didn't pretend to be "standard" - Dell tried very hard to appear to be "standard" while, at the time, was anything but.

Really "old news".

WPS2, not WPS but the WiFi is separate from my network anyway. I only have WiFi for guests.

I was a (field) support specialist. That is about as deep in the trench as you get. I bailed out the techs who couldn't fix things. I chose to get out of the business when it became "cut open the box and plug in a new one". I worked at the component level for most of my career on stuff a whole lot more complex than a PC. The processor alone might have 1000 cards in it. RAM was core, 2 meg disk drives were the size of a washing machine and leaked oil on the floor. Toward the end I got into Physical Planning (in Florida that is mostly lightning protection), connectivity and structured wiring.

You could have gotten an ATX adapter to do that for you. Much less risk of forgetting to swap the other wires which would result in frying the board and/or PSU...Which is why you told him not to just try moving the start wire, right? [g] You do realize, the PSU only needs the PS ON wire to connect to a negative line and it will try to come online, right? You were very lucky the non standard Dell didn't opt to do that when you stuck the ATX connector to it, you would have fried it if it did.

Dell, HP, Compaq, etc. All guilty of stupid things like that.

So you know you can convert an XP disc to oem,retail,vendor or vlk by changing five files, right? :) As, that's the only difference between the discs. Four bins, one ini, everything else is identical to the very byte. I'm not discussing the rules of licensing mind you, just the physical aspects of the contents of the disc itself.

Do you know how the vendor specific routine works? You've seen it in action. Let's take a 'Dell' branded XP OS cd for example. You notice that when you install it on the machine it shipped with, it never asks for a key, right?

Well, that's because it's checking the BIOS for a string, and it'll match a string inside one of the oembios* files (the four binaries) I mentioned previously. As long as it matches, you're golden; no cd key required.

If you take the same 'Dell' branded XP disc and load it on a non dell, you're prompted for the key. And the type of key it wants is controlled by the .ini file (retail,oem,vlk). You could take an HP 'branded' XP disc and convert it for use with a Dell, or vice versa, or, create your own branded disc if you wanted.

Obviously, you will need viable copies of the four files for each type of 'vendor' specific disc you want to create, as well as the set for retail,oem, and vlk. You should also copy the setupp.inf file as well; as this determines the type of keys the disc will accept. It is necessary if you wish to convert one of yours to say, VLK edition. (Volume License; they don't have to activate with MS)

The files you're looking to muck with are appropriately named oembios.bin,oembios.cat,oembios.sig,oembios.dat (they are compressed on the XP cd and stored as oembios.bi_,oembios.si_,oembios.ca_,oembios_da inside your /i386 folder) and of course, the setupp.inf file. That determines the type of key the disc will take, if you're prompted.

Saved me a lot of time reloading systems for an employer I once had. I could convert our oem discs to whatever I needed for the task. If the customer lost his/her Dell disc, for example, I could replace it for them. And, it would work just fine for their Dell. No key required. And, I wasn't pirating. I had copies of the four bins plus the .ini for damn near everything that came across my bench. If we got a new machine say, acer, I dilligently copied those files and added them to our server, in the event we needed it later. It would be a burned disc, but would be branded for the Acer. [g]

Btw, this 'trick' works for XP home and pro. There's very little difference on disc between the two. And it is possible to convert a 'home' disc to a 'pro' disc, if you really wanted to do so.

I respect the time you've both put into it, but, with that said, I don't think either of you would be schooling me anytime soon on things PC related. Mainframes, etc, certainly; I have very little hands on experience with them.

I'm not writing about WPA/WPA2. There's no such thing as WPS2 (yet anyway) I specifically asked you about WPS being enabled. If WPS is active, one could hack that within a few seconds and recover a viable WPA2 key without your assistance which would give them guest access. but, more importantly, the ability to talk to your router. Depending on the router and the firmware, one might be able to leave your guest network and access the hard lines machines on it. And that's just one way of gaining access that one shouldn't have. It's also possible your router has vulnerabilities you know nothing about, and, all one would need in those cases is the WAN side IP address. no 'wifi' required there. Can your service provider access your router and apply updates/change things on it for you? If so, it's quite possible I could too.

WPS is vulnerable. And your router if it's one supplied from your internet provider (I'm guessing your phone company?) most likely is exploitable once you can 'talk' to it, even with the guest network.

So, one would take advantage of WPS being enabled, gain access via WPA2 thanks to it, and, then, depending on the firmware, take control of the router and setup another wifi point that doesn't isolate itself from the rest of your network.

From there, it's a matter of exploring and poking around (no pun intended). You've already told me a windows 98 box is acting as a server, I'd hit that one first, it would be the easiest. It'll share drive mappings and network topology. That would allow me to know about some of the systems present on your network and the IP addresses assigned to them, if you're using DHCP. Most do.

And, that's just one way, off the top of my head of breaking into your network. if I knew the specific make and model of your router, I might not even have to go through all that hassle and I could possibly do it from the internet. No 'wifi' access required. Your router might even be so kind as to tell me it's make and model, depending on it's firmware revision.

If you don't know what WPS is, you probably don't need it, AND, should disable it. Don't trust your router when it tells you it's off, either. check to be sure! Some will say it's off, but, it's not. Due to, again, a bug in firmware.

If you're comfortable using linux, I recommend kali linux for penetration testing. If you have a spare laptop, you can boot it from usb into kali and test the security of your network from there.

As I said, I'm not trying to be condescending or rude with you, I'm simply trying to ascertain your knowledge level concerning the PC.

While I certainly appreciate your comment and can relate to bailing out other techs who couldn't fix things, I don't believe we're discussing the same things here. Hence, my questions.

I used a sony vaio laptop as an internet web & email server from 2002 to 2010. Only rebooted it once in that nine year stretch, due to a power failure and the built-in battery no longer held a charge. Put it on an external UPS after that for the next four years. Running Redhat 8.2.

YMMV

The best security I have is distance. There are only a couple people within WiFi distance and I would give them my key if they asked. If someone is war driving through my neighborhood they might find themselves confronted by armed people asking them what the hell they were doing there. This is Florida. Neighborhood watch is an armed response. Even if they got into that router, there is another wall between there and my home network. All they could do is skim some internet without some more work.

Yep. Our company farmed it's custom PCBs out to a company that had jest won the Malcom Baldridge Awared for Quality. Yet, they still tried to sub out our PCB components fer cheaper one's (that often did not work) so THEY could save money. We hadda go back and spec all the components WE wanted cuz the boards began failing.

I also helped a buddy test some memory sticks that were being returned to him (Infineon) for alleged failures. We tested 'em all and discovered it wasn't the memory sticks at all. They all worked fine. It was the cheapo memory stick finger connector strips that had been substituted by Dell to save money on their motherboards. The finger strips were the wrong size and therefor did not exert enough pressure to make good contact with the memory sticks.

nb

Yeah, the joke in the 90s was people were getting those yellow envelopes in the mail that said "You may have already won the Malcolm Baldridge Award"