I have an in-panel 20A gfci breaker which will soon be wired to the outlet
next to the sink in the bathroom . Later , when I add a kitchen , I'd like
to supply the outlets near the sink from the same breaker , and here's the
question - Is it OK to run 2 branches from the same breaker as long as I
don't exceed the max number of outlets ? I guess if it came right down to it
I could wire the other outlets from the one in the bath , but that's a waste
of copper IMO since I'd have to backtrack at least 15 ft .
There WILL be multiple 20A circuits in the kitchen including dedicated
ones for fridge , microwave , etc . Only the ones near the sink will be on
this GFCI . Probably a total of 3 outlets max on a 20A breaker , not a
problem AFAIK ... just the question about how to feed them . FWIW , I tend
to limit outlet circuits to 4 outlets , though I think you can have up to
like 6 .
Say what Willis ? This is NOT the only feed for the kitchen , it's only
for 2 outlets nearest the sink There will probably be more like 4 or 5
circuits for the kitchen , when you include lighting and dedicated runs for
the fridge , microwave etc .
The bathroom lights have their own 15A breaker , as do the living room
lights . The only thing <in the bathroom> this circuit will feed is one
outlet , which will seldom be used . We don't primp ... nor do I shave .
There is no specified maximum number of receptacles in a residence.
You just have a required amount of VA per square foot (3) and the
receptacles are supposed to be "Evenly Proportioned Among Branch
In commercial you are limited to 180 VA per duplex outlet.
The requirements are for two 20 amp "small appliance" circuits in the
kitchen serving the counter top, one 20a for the bathroom and one 20A
for the laundry.
You can put the fridge on one of the small appliance circuits or you
can put in a dedicated 15a circuit.
*Gfretwell is correct. The code only permits the bathroom 20 amp circuit to
feed the bathroom receptacle. It is permissible to feed multiple BATHROOM
receptacles from the one 20 amp circuit. The kitchen is required to have
two 20 amp circuits that only feed the kitchen and dining areas. Read
articles 210.11(C) and 210.23(A) Exception in the National Electrical Code
or check with your local inspector before you call for inspection.
Well , I don't know much about code as I don't work daily with wiring and
sparktricity ... but I can kinda see it and I'll just use that circuit to
power outlets in the master bath when I build it - it'll be on a common wall
with this bathroom <<better run a line to a conbox under the house before I
close up that wall !>> . It's pretty easy to use a GFCI outlet in the string
and feed one more from it , which is probably what I'll do in the kitchen .
I have that breaker from a previous wiring config here at the camper , it
was in the temp power supply box .
Thanks for the info , you and gfretwell have helped me design the power
system for the next phases of construction . Oh , and out here in the
boonies we don't have inspections . All the more reason for me to ask
questions and solicit information , I fershure don't want to burn the place
On Monday, April 21, 2014 11:52:39 PM UTC-4, Terry Coombs wrote:
you fail to realize that while someone, you or a future family could be getting ready for work in the bathroom while another family member is busy making breakfast. both going on at the same time can easily trip a single breaker:(
In bathroom, a curling iron and hairdryer are being used, while in the kitchen the coffe pot is doing its thing, the can opener is being used, etc etc etc...
now if you claim we dont live this way KNOW IN ADVANCE when you go to sell your home this code breaking idea will be caught by any decent home inspector...
so do it right, do it once, and forget about it.....
GFCIs arent expensive! I prefer the ones in the outlet rather than the breaker, easier to reset ....
if you are out of slots in your main panel add a sub panel or replace your main panel
Heh , the blow dryer is used here to fan the woodstove ... and I'm retired
Just the 2 of us ... and if you catch my wife with a curling iron I want
pictures , it'll be a first .
This home won't be sold , we plan on living out our allotted days here -
might be a fight between the kids who gets it but by then we won't be here
so ... and you'd be surprised at what will fly around here . We are so rural
they have to pipe in daylight ...
That's the plan , and why I'm asking .
True , I've replaced a couple in the camper .
Brand new panel , new construction and I bought the biggest 200 amp box I
could afford that has copper bus bars - has room for like 40 breakers if I
use some slimline units . Should be enough for a 3 room shack . Oh , and I
do have a sub panel for the shop fed from the main panel . When the dust
settles and the wiring is in it's final configuration that sub will be fed
from a 60 amp breaker . Right now we're still on the temp pole , awaiting
the ground drying enough to get a truck in to move the service to the new
On Tuesday, April 22, 2014 11:54:31 AM UTC-4, bob haller wrote:
Apparently he wanted to save using an additonal GFCI breaker. I don't get it
either. I'd rather keep circuits somewhat separate and logically organized,
even if it was allowed by code. Also, I agree with you that having the GFCI
function in the outlet is preferred. If it trips, you can reset it without
a trip to the breaker panel.
FWIW. New construction here north of Phoenix, circa 2010
bathrooms have branch, but 'peel' off a GFCI outlet for plugs above sinks
kitchen is large and has rows of outlets ALL GFCI types, however...
there is breaker to built-in uWave/oven, breaker to cooking top, breaker
to fridge, breaker to dishwashwer, breaker to rows of outlets: there are
outlets above island counter and outlets above kitchen counter lining the
wall. all are GFCI type.
There are four outlets in the island counter with ONE controlling GFCI,
the others 'daughter' off it.
Above the main kitchen counters are two sets of GFCI controlled outlets.
One set of three and one set of four outlets. Each set has main GFCI
resettable, the others 'daughter' off them.
One breaker takes out ALL those GFCI outlets. AND the stove top exhaust
[Fom memory, but will double check that ALL the outlets go down with one
Had to be to somebody's code, else how did pass inspection?
This is really not an issue about burning the house down. It will only
cause nuisance tripping of breakers. (as long as you size the wire to
The issue is hair dryers and the appliances that get hot in the
kitchen. They gobble up a 20a circuit pretty fast. Back in the olden
days when the bathroom receptacles just ran electric razors, you could
pretty much ignore that load. These days they sell hair dryers based
on how much power they use. (even if it is usually a lie)
*How about posting pictures of the job as it progresses so we can follow.
Also, almost every lighting and receptacle circuit will require arc fault
protection as per article 210.12(A). They will help reduce fires from loose
I remember the frustration when trying to buy a hair dryer. I asked 3
1. what is the exit air temperature?
2. what is the volumetric flow against, say, a 1 inch flat surface?
3. what is the dBA at my ears?
The answer I got was shown the label declaring 1500W hair dryer! and a
As an attempt to make the salesperson understand, I pointed out that a
light bulb could use 1500W and never dry one's hair.
PS: never found the answers from ANY manufacturer. You'd think one would
want to dominate the market as THE expert.
Might be two, but remember only one, haven't checked yet. no, the breaker
is dedicated to just the kitchen, big [kitchen, not the breaker].
Breakfast nook adjacent and Dining room is about 100 feet away adjacent to
drawing room and entrance areas, with two breakers to the dining room,
probably for buffet heaters type stuff in butler's pantry.
Bear in mind this is the minimum requirement. Larger kitchens should
have more circuits, as a design issue. I do find it interesting when
people build huge 7 figure houses and cheap out on the things behind
the wall. I have a tiny "one ass" kitchen and it has 3 small appliance
circuits plus one for the fridge although I did cheat a little and
left the hood on the fridge circuit. (that was existing when I
renovated the room).
How many people ask those questions? If any given manufacturer made that
information readily accessible do you really think their sales would sky
How does it feel in my hand?
That's probably all that the huge majority of people care about.
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