GFCI outlet question.

[Doug Miller]

You *really* should stop talking about the electrical code, since it's clear that you have at best a sketchy understanding of what it requires.

The "80% rule" applies only to continuous loads. A continuous load is explicitly defined by the Code as maximum current for 3 hours or more, and this clearly does not apply to a refrigerator, or a freezer, or a garage door opener. (If you want to know what a continous load looks like, think resistance heating, or air conditioners.)

There aren't any code issues with that circuit. The problem is simply that the OP is plugging too much stuff into it. Sometimes, that stuff draws too much current, and the breaker trips. That's the way it's *supposed* to work.

The OP needs a second circuit, but that's only because he's trying to plug in more stuff than the existing circuit is capable of handling -- not because of any "code issues" that you imagine to exist.

[...]

The circuit is fine. The problem is that the OP has too much crap plugged into it.

[...]

Of course it doesn't. It isn't supposed to.

[trader4]

Yeah, funny how he comes up with his version of what code says, but then wants us to go find it. I'd also like to see where in the code it says if I simply choose to plug a chest freezer into an existing outlet in my garage, I have to bring the entire garage up to current NEC code.

I especially liked this part too:

"> Right, until some part within the refrigerator or new chest freezer

So his approach is to run additional higher current circuits to support failing appliances that are drawing twice the load they should, instead of replacing the appliance. That doesn't sound like a very safe or economical solution to me. If a chest freezer is failing and somehow using 2X the electricity it should use, a new one would pay for itself in a few years. I just replaced a 23 year old refrigerator with a larger unit that uses about $95 a year less in electricity. You can buy a chest freezer for what, $400? And there is obvious environmental benefit as well.

Bottom line is the best place to start is to determine what all the loads are pulling on that circuit. Then a proper determination can be made.

[Evan]

LOL... Or you could pay attention to your "failing appliances" and repair the $20 or $30 timer or relay that is causing it to use more power...

But I guess that is too much fine detail for a guy follows the letter of the NEC code without applying any common sense...

Do you totally replace a light fixture when the bulb burns out ???

Bottom line ??? Got too much crap drawing more than 1,440 watts being fed from a circuit that traverses the entire house from the location of the feed to the point where the load is being drawn...

Sounds like the refrigerator might need repair or some new power tools are too powerful given the wattage of the constant load from the fridge/freezer...

Don't need a code encyclopedia or a slide rule to figure that one out...

~~ Evan

[bud--]

Some of this is covered nicely by Doug.

Essentially all the "code requirements" are nonexistent (what a surprise).

Cite - using the NEC.

The probability of 2 devices starting at exactly the same time is nil. And the delay built into any residential circuit breaker would likely withstand the momentary overload.

It rather easy to have too much running overload or starting current on top of running current from another unit.

Sorry - my Ouija board still isn't giving me an answer. I really don't think much wiring in a house uses the next conductor size.

I'm sure that happens all the time......

Nicely covered by trader. No doubt everyone at this newsgroup would want adequate circuit capacity so that refrigerator could continue to draw at least twice the power it should.

I guess you don't have much useful common sense.

Maybe your (alleged) inspector would. Not likely in the real world.

How insightful that trader included a new circuit as one of his possible fixes.

Some of the people who ask questions are actually half-way intelligent. (Some of the people answering aren't.)

If the OP followed your advice to add a circuit in "a full metal conduit" that is buried, and the metal disappeared from rust, his kid could electrocuted from the lack of a ground on a grounded outlet.

1 - I answered only you, not others 2 - I *never* cited the NEC 3 - you cited imaginary code requirements I challenged your hallucinations 4 - your posts have been largely based on imaginary NEC requirements. my post (and trader's) were based on good thoughtful advice

Is there a "NEC envy" kinda like "penis envy" - you seem to have it.

It might help if you responses were not dogmatic there-is-only-one-way-to-do-this.

I thought trader's multiple choice answer was entirely reasonable.