I have a swimming pool pump for the filter that is supposed to run 24 hours a day.
The pump can run in either 230V/7.5A or 115V/15A settings. The old owners of the house elected to run it 230/7.5A It's going to remain this way because the GFI breaker is for 230 and occupies two breaker spots. So is this double pole? The circuit itself is still only 15 amp.
My first question is why 230/7.5A instead of 115V/15A? If I do the calculations right both equal 1725 Watts so from a utility billing standpoint no diff? Any other reason to go 230?
Second question is the wire from the pump to the outlet is only 16 AWG. Seems a bit undersized? should this be a 12 awg? Is 16 awg acceptable for
7.5 amps 24 hours a day?
Third question is to turn motor off I have to unplug and replug. A real pain come weekly filter cleaning time. I'd like to wire a toggle switch in the pool shed but I can't find a switch that is rated for 230V/15A. All I see are 115/120/125V 15 or 20 amp switches. Maybe this is the switch I'm supposed to use for a 230V/15 amp
BTW I should add that this is a 2 wire plus ground wire from the main panel to the outlet. So a white, black and green. This mean there are two hot and no neutral on this circuit?
OK - I'll see if I can help explain. At double the voltage a device uses half the current to produce the same power - This means you can get away with lighter wiring - and you have less "loss" over the same length of wire. Generally speaking you run motors at their highest rated voltage for best effiicency. By LAW you need a "disconnect" at the pump - the previous owner cheaped out and used a plug for a disconnect. The proper "switch" would be a 220 volt "disconnect" - which GENERALLY has a breaker in it that gets used as a switch. Older disconnects had a "knife switch" and had 2 fuses in them. The breaker currently used in the main panel, as well as the one that would be used in a "disconnect" are "double pole" breakers.
14 gauge wire is rated for a 15 amp load. 16 gauge is fine for 10 amps, so as long as the motor has built in overcurrent protection, 16 gauge wire is perfectly adequate for the 220 volt connection, but would be inadequate for 115 volts.
You are correct - as long as there is nothing requiring 110 volts, no neutral is required. The wires SHOULD be either both marked black, or one black and one red. Either taped or painted has been accepted for years - not sure exactly what CODE says today.
The other posters here have explained why the installer chose to use the double pole 240v motor for that load...
You would find it difficult to locate a 2 pole switch in 15 amps as there are not many 15 amp circuits allowed in commercial buildings where such loads are more common...
The smallest wire most electricians will run to anything from a panel is
14 gauge. It's just a common practice with the majority of electricians running power. Low voltage is another story. All the control systems I've ever built had a minimum #14 bringing power in with #16 and smaller gauge used for wiring the guts of the system. My favorite safety switch or disconnect is the QO200TRCP manufactured by Square D. It looks like a QO circuit breaker but has no over current protection, it's just a big switch.
The smallest wire most electricians will run to anything from a panel is
14 gauge. It's just a common practice with the majority of electricians running power. Low voltage is another story. All the control systems I've ever built had a minimum #14 bringing power in with #16 and smaller gauge used for wiring the guts of the system.
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The wire from the panel to the outlet is 14 gauge. The wire from the outlet to the pump is 16 gauge.
I just bought a 725 watt dehumidifier that uses 18 gauge in it's cord. makes me wonder.
Typically you would use the higher voltage to be able to reduce wire size. In this case it wouldn't matter other than slight efficiency difference.
If you are in the U.S., and this is anything but a storable pool, the cord to the pump is required to be 12 gauge. The requirement isn't for the current carrying conductors, just the ground. The same is true for the conductors feeding the receptacle.
The standard circuit breakers in the electrical panel are meant to protect the wire not the equipment. That's why the equipment has its own little fuse or circuit breaker. Your 725 watt dehumidifier only draws around 6.5 amps at he most so the 18 gauge wire is OK.
Frankly I'd go ahead and install a timer as well. You can save a fair bit of money by not running that pump 24/7. Most people find they can keep the pool clean on a shorter cycle depending on use.
It's perfectly permissible to use a cord on a pool pump. Some installers do it so they can be removed for the winter. I agree I would personally install it hardwired, but it doesn't mean it was done with a plug to be cheap. I'd say the cheap and stupid part of the equation is that it was installed without a switch. I'd take a careful look at the rest of this install job, particularly that everything is properly grounded and bonded.
It's not an issue of older versus newer disconnects. You can go right down to HD and buy a disconnect that does not have a switch, only a pull out plug that cuts the power. They are very commonly used for AC condenser units, heat pumps. etc.
In this case, he could use a disconnect that includes a switch. But I'd back up a step. Why is this pool pump running 24/7? Drawing
7.5 amps, it sounds like a single speed 1hp motor. Typically such a pump is only run around 6 or 8 hours a day. By installing a timer box made for pools, he would get his switch and a timer to only run the pump as much as needed for filtering and save a lot of $$$.
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Why should he do that? If there is no 120V load, there is no need for a neutral conductor, and no point in having one. What do you propose he connect it to, anyway?
No need for neutral. There is nothing that requires 120v like lights or control panel etc. It's for a motor only.
What's funny is I replaced that 230 V outlet last year to a nice brand new one that lacked rust and scorch marks. I don't recall the wire behind that box being red and black and bare.
It's perfectly permissible to use a cord on a pool pump. Some installers do it so they can be removed for the winter. I agree I would personally install it hardwired, but it doesn't mean it was done with a plug to be cheap. I'd say the cheap and stupid part of the equation is that it was installed without a switch. I'd take a careful look at the rest of this install job, particularly that everything is properly grounded and bonded.
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OP Response: The motor has to be turned off to service the filter periodically, in my case once a week. Water cannot be flowing thru the filter when the filter valve is set to any of the cleaning or rinsing cycles. Essentially you use pool water to backfluch these filters. Water has to stop to allow the valve to be turned to a backflush setting.
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It's not an issue of older versus newer disconnects. You can go right down to HD and buy a disconnect that does not have a switch, only a pull out plug that cuts the power. They are very commonly used for AC condenser units, heat pumps. etc.
In this case, he could use a disconnect that includes a switch. But I'd back up a step. Why is this pool pump running 24/7? Drawing
7.5 amps, it sounds like a single speed 1hp motor. Typically such a pump is only run around 6 or 8 hours a day. By installing a timer box made for pools, he would get his switch and a timer to only run the pump as much as needed for filtering and save a lot of $$$.
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OP Response: Well the longer a pool filter/motor runs, the cleaner the pool water. It is the only way to circulate the pool water. In My case the pool is 16' x 32' x 10' deep. That's a lot of water. I run the pool motor/filtration usually between 6 pm and 6 am but ideally you would run it
24 hours a day especially if it's heavily used pool. I have a lot of trees around my pool and algae builds up easily for example. Right now my ideal is running the filter 12 hours a day (at 5.9 cents per KWhr) and it keeps things crystal clear.
The timer box and disconnect for pools and spas in my part of Canada are about $300. I don't mind using the plug the turn on turn off, however a switch would just be easier. For every filter cleaning it's turn on turn off 4 times.
Frankly I'd go ahead and install a timer as well. You can save a fair bit of money by not running that pump 24/7. Most people find they can keep the pool clean on a shorter cycle depending on use.
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But I can't find a timer that works for 230v/15 amp cicuitry. The only timers I see are part of a $300 spa/pool/hot tub kit
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