do all projects end like this?

[Kevin Ricks]

When hand-washing dishes I like a double sink. But then its not really used except to let the dishes drip dry in on a wire rack that I have laying across the second sink. Way back when I was single and had roommates we use one sink to hold dirty dishes and the other one free to use as a sink.

A lot of newer faucets have the integrated pull out sprayer. I find these better and more useful than the old awkward hose sprayers which rarely got used except to spay me in the face when I grab it wrong...

These integrated types take up less holes. Some models use only one hole total for spigot/sprayer and H&C water valves. So changing the faucet to one of these may give you extra holes for the air gap. At one house filled 2 unused holes with pump dispensers for liquid hand soap and dish washing liquid. Then she wanted a hand lotion dispenser...

The fixture I have now has pullout sprayer and covers 3 holes. 1 is soap dispenser (built into the fixture flange), 1 for everything else, 1 hole is not used but covered by the flange.

Having to have an air gap depends on how the dishwasher and drain is installed. I don't remember the details. Something to do with how high the drain hose is in relation to the connection point. Look at the dishwasher installation manual. The last dishwasher I installed did not need one as per the installation instructions. I believe I used the high loop method. As someone else said codes may require one regardless. I've seen some air gaps put into the counter top would not recommend that.

Kevin

[HeyBub]

If your hand fits a screwdriver, both the ethernet card and hard drive replacement are, together, a two-minute job.

Hard drive manufacturers have downloads on their sites (for free) that will copy your stuff from your old hard drive to the new hard drive.

Assuming you're running some variety of windows, visit the "msnews.microsoft.com" newsgroup directory, pick the site that seems best and post your question. There are, for example, 13 different newsgroups involved with Vista, 27 for XP. These are in English; there are more if you count Italian, French, etc.

[Nate Nagel]

I was kind of shying away from the faucets with the pull out sprayer; I guess I just kind of considered it something else to go wrong. I was anticipating everything getting floppy and leaky with age, is this a real concern? I don't know anyone that has had one for more than a year or two, so I don't know if I'm worried about nothing or not. I guess I was just assuming I would be using the separate pull out sprayer for "KISS" reasons.

Looks like I will have to replace a couple valves too... the hot water shutoff valve seems to be weeping past the stem (big shocker, house is

60 years old) so the snowballing of the project continues...

I wish I had the intestinal fortitude to attempt rebuilding the valves in place, but I just don't have the experience that tells me I can do it. Nothing says "excitement" like soldering while on your back inches away from wood paneling...

nate

[Bill]

They do at my very old house!

Basically whenever I tear anything apart, I find more problems and the project winds up costing a lot more than I expected.

For example I had a leaky horizontal drain pipe going from the kitchen sink to outside. A few bucks to replace right? NO! I wound up having to replace that pipe, the pipe going down, and the pipe going all the way under the house to the other side of the house.

The previous owner of the house installed this drain pipe (under the house) basically level. Then proceeded to fill it up with grease from the kitchen. It was solid grease for the entire length of the pipe. Then they poured tons of drain cleaner into the drain which ate away at the pipes and it was actually draining out the bottom of the pipe and not a drop going into the sewer. Luckily plastic drain pipe is not too expensive, so was just a lot of work. (I installed the new drain pipe at the correct angle.)

[Edwin Pawlowski]

If the valves are very old, forget rebuilding, it will be a PITA at best. If they are relatively new, replacing the cartridge is simple enough to do.

I used to visit my MIL a couple of times a year and she had similar situations like a dripping faucet. I'd have fixed it for her, but after all the years I'd probably have to replace everything out to the street so I never tried it. If I had a week, it would be easier to just replace everything along the way. Best thing she ever did was finally sell the house "as is" and moved in with us. .

[gfretwell]

My mom wanted to replace an old toilet seat and ended up remodelling the bathroom. (the bozo handyman cracked the toilet yada yada)

[aemeijers]

Chuckle. I plan on a project taking twice as long as it should, and costing half again as much money. I also try to plan a fallback position- if the project utterly crashes and burns on me, how do I keep the house livable and weather proof, etc, in the meantime, while I call in professional help? (I'm a big believer in having shutoff valves on plumbing runs, replacing all the replaceable pieces as long as I have something apart anyway, etc. And never start a plumbing project past noon on Saturday- starting later will ensure you are missing a needed part when the stores close.) Parts are cheap, my time and ambition are precious. If I don't have a warm fuzzy that I can do something successfully, I hire it out, and watch and learn for next time.

aem sends...

[Nate Nagel]

Past noon? The real plumbing supply place near me closes at 1PM on Saturday, leaving me only the fallback of Home Despot until Monday evening. You're a lucky man.

Yes, I started demoing my sink drain at about 8AM on Saturday because I figured I would demo first, then buy what I needed before the store closed. Came upstairs while I was getting ready to leave and SWMBO was asleep with a pillow over her head. :)

nate

[Steve]

Nate Nagel wrote on 02 Dec 2007 in group alt.home.repair:

If you have available pipe sticking out of the wall, you can cut the valve off and replace it with a compression fitting -- no sweating pipes.

[Douglas Johnson]

Doug's law of old houses: Every little project has a big one hiding behind it.

-- Doug

[hallerb]

ahh before replacing just try tightening the packing nut a quarter turn. this will compress the packing a little and end the drip.

works over 99% of the time.

if you must replace the valve install ball valves, they cost a bit more but are far superior, easy to close fast, and last forever

[Douglas Johnson]

We had one for 8 years that we replaced for decor reasons in a remodel. It worked fine all those years. The current one has about 4 years on it and going strong. I wouldn't have a kitchen without one.

My rule on old house plumbing is that, once I have started to rebuild a sink or whatever, to tear it out to the wall (or to the pipes coming out of the wall) and rebuild forward. I've found it easier and more dependable to put all new parts in.

-- Doug

[Pete C.]

Try "Chicklet", that should go over well... assuming you have good insurance...

[Pete C.]

Parts (both plumbing and electrical) are cheap, so I keep well stocked parts kits with everything I might need for the typical projects. I figure the perhaps $100 (combined) in parts on hand will easily save that just in the gas that would otherwise be required to run out and get parts as needed.

[mike]

e's no

e quoted text -

Get the biggest single basin sink that you can fit in your cabinets. If you have a dishwasher, there is no reason to have two basins. Period. Home Depot is not the place to shop for kitchen sinks.

Read your dishwasher manual for how to loop your drain line.

[Noozer]

There is a VERY good reason to have two basins... Thawing items and washing veggies.

Get a double sink - one side LARGE and one side small.

[mike]

You don't need to sacrifice large interrupted space for thawing items in water. Thaw items in bowl or in a small plasitc bin that you store under the sink. Place the bin in the sink, and you have a water thaw area that doesn't pose a permanent obstacle.

Now you can can wash cookie sheets, fridge shelves, oversized pots and pans, etc. And with one drain, you don't have to scoop crud from one side to the side with a garbage disposal (yuck). Every scrap of food waste in the sink gets ground up automatically.

So in fact there is no reason for a double basin sink if you have a dishwasher.

[mike]

That should read UNinterrupted

[aemeijers]

(snip)

I'll agree with that. I'm not organized enough to build a stockpile in any planned fashion, but I always keep any extra parts- every few years I get motivated enough to sort out all the misc screws, bolts, brackets, etc. And when I replaced some 2-hole outlets and some worn-out switches, I rounded up the numbers and bought the 'contractor' 10-packs, since the unit cost was lower anyway. I've used a couple from shelf stock since then. Fasteners, unless they are expensive, I will buy by the box instead of the overpriced baggies.

I need to get off my ass (and off this time-sucking Usenet) and sort out that island of trash-picked milk crates in my basement, where my tool and part stockpiles have sat since I moved in 2.5 years ago. They are sorted by category, but small bins (that I don't have) on a bank of shelves down there (that I haven't built yet) would work SO much better...

(the milk crates did work out pretty well in the 2x5 patio storage closet in the apartment where I lived for 12 years before buying the house...)

aem sends...