Did they change treated lumber AGAIN?

[JoeSpareBedroom]

So, if you find out that your kid has a toy which was later recalled due to high levels of lead, you let the kid keep the toy?

Yes or no.

Do you let the kid keep the toy?

[BobK207]

[JoeSpareBedroom]

Then, you're smarter than about 54% of the population at large. Good.

[dpb]

This futile, of course, but I'll make one last stab at gaining at least a tiny bit of understanding...

Were the studies of lead ingestion in toddlers and infants in the tenement housing in Chicago controlled studies?

Since the weren't, I presume they're to be considered bogus? (And, parenthetically, since the "test subjects" weren't provided the opportunity to sign a waiver a priori, obviously the authors were guilty of a crime or at a minimum, grossly unethical behavior in pointing this out I gather from your previous words?)

What you're obviously missing is observational epidemiology.

When there becomes an occurrence of any medical phenomenon, folks start looking for root-cause explanations. They start out by collecting as many cases of similar symptoms from similar circumstances as possible and looking for patterns and statistically significant incidence rates above background and correlations w/ conditions.

If these screening studies show up stuff that is the least bit suspicious, they move on to more and more extensive and detailed analyses. Eventually, sometimes, as in the case of the lead, they do actually uncover problems with long-accepted practices and make changes based on those findings.

OTOH, not always are the studies positive--that is, sometimes despite a hypothesis that a particular product or action is potentially harmful, an analysis of results simply doesn't support that conclusion.

Ah yes, the ultimate weapon..."Do it for the kids"...

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[JoeSpareBedroom]

Well, that's what competent parents do. Even many animals do the same.

[Edwin Pawlowski]

If the kid is beyond the chewing stage, why not? Touching or being near it won't harm you. Scout badges were recalled because the yellow trim had too much lead. If a cub or boy scout is chewing his badges, there are other problems.

[JoeSpareBedroom]

OK. The kid's still in the chewing stage. Do you let him keep the toy?

[hallerb]

for a gazillion years smokers said hey it didnt kill me therefore smoking is safe, blamimg lung cancer and other nasties on other things.........

today we know for a FACT that smoking KILLS, fact is big tobacco knew and covered it up for many years:(

Big tobacco did their own studies.

treated wood manufacturers did their own studies, its highly possible they proved the hazards.

now would they admit it??? heavens know that will just bring on lawsuits:(

better to change the formula and hope for the best!

[HeyBub]

So what? Increased Arsenic levels are not indicative of a health problem.

So you agree that increased Arsenic levels mean almost nothing.

The parents don't have to be involved that way. Test kids who've hung out on wood playsets vs kids who've played on metal playsets.

The reasons this kind of testing hasn't been done is that it would be a waste of money, not that that's ever bother the government and any researcher who published such findings would be laughed out of the profession.

[HeyBub]

And I told you your pediatrician is probably an idiot. An appeal to authority works only if the "authority" IS an authority. Pediatricans (in general) are more driven by emotion and political correctness than objective fact.

Bottom line: We reject your "expert." Come up with another.

[HeyBub]

He got his information from a pediatrician. The fact that pediatricians poll their young patients over gun handling by the parents is sufficient evidence to conclude pediatricians are loons and can safely be ignored in areas outside their experience. Inasmuch as no pediatrician anywhere has ever experienced a medical problem originating from CCA, I'd say their competence on this score is zero.

But it's worse. There are people who run their lives based on the statements of loons.

[dadiOH]

So the long term effects of the new formulation are known? Geez...quick.

[Rick Blaine]

Sure. My kids don't chew on their toys. This lead paint thing on toys is getting blown way out of proportion.

-- "Tell me what I should do, Annie." "Stay. Here. Forever." - Life On Mars

[dadiOH]

Competent parents didn't do it (change PT formulation), government did.

[Rick Blaine]

Probably not. That's a decision that I make as a critical thinking adult who can balance cost vs. benefit. I do not need a government acting on my behalf banning all uses of a useful substance just because some parent somewhere was incapable of making a similar judgement.

-- "Tell me what I should do, Annie." "Stay. Here. Forever." - Life On Mars

[Rick Blaine]

We as individual parents can make the decisions necessary as we see fit. We do not need a third party (either government or trial lawyers) making those decisions for us.

-- "Tell me what I should do, Annie." "Stay. Here. Forever." - Life On Mars

[Rick Blaine]

Prescisely. They do not need a nanny doing it for them.

-- "Tell me what I should do, Annie." "Stay. Here. Forever." - Life On Mars

[dpb]

Well, that's not at all clear to me. I could not find any actual directive from EPA, CPSC, OSHA, ... that actually does that.

As Robert Allison noted, it appears the change was made through the manufacturers' associations of the various producers.

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[JoeSpareBedroom]

Two relatively recent and accurate polls indicate that 54% of the population is NOT capable of making good decisions. I'm OK with Darwin's principles shaving a few off the population, but 54% is a bit too much.

[dpb]

Joe, otoh, being a totally responsible parent would of course, not allow his kids to have toys on the presumption they _would_ contain lead. :)

Although in reality, I must presume that being such a stellar protector of the young he thought even farther ahead and has therefore ensured he doesn't have any in order to fully protect them from all of these inevitable hazards.

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