During feezing weather, I like to leave a faucet dripping to reduce the chances of freezing pipe. However, people including me sometimes forget and turn off the faucet completely.
Is there a dedicated valve that can be installed under the sink to let a trickle of water out and directly into the p trap? This way nobody sees the dripping and cannot accidentally turn it off.
How about a piercing valve for like an ice maker. That gives you a bit of water, and some tubing you can run here or there.
Not the faucet, rather the pipe that some dummy ran in an uninsulated exterior wall.
Real tough to tell if you are serious, but I'll play along...
Define "dripping" in terms of enough to prevent freezing.
Why are you concerned with this particular faucet freezing in the first place?
There's lot of details that you should be sharing.
Maybe it's in an outhouse. ;-)
I had that happen, one time. Cinder block building, and it froze in front of a window. I crumpled a bunch of news paper, stuffed in, and the pipe didn't freeze again.
I got to thaw a frozen pipe one time, cellar of an old farm house. Froze right at a window. It was about 7F outside, and the sash didn't seal well. I put in a couple zip screws to hold it.
I really cannot say, but I have heard that the dripping faucet thing does not work for faucets. I do not remember from where, but I do believe it was a reputable source. Take that at face value since I cannot confirm or refute the claim. However, if true, then the same could be true for a P-trap. Without true experimentation and repetitive results, how could one truly know? Old wives tales and all, ya know.
Anyway, I have also heard that stuffing a wire coat hanger, with a slight bend and rounded off tip (via pliers) stuffed down into the trap, and cut off flush with the strainer basket conducts enough heat to keep things thawed. Once again, I cannot not confirm this. Though, I do believe I heard about this a long time ago on the Bill Wattenberg (sp?) show on KGO AM. At least 6 years ago.
I do know that the dripping faucet keeps my water supply from freezing whe n it gets below 32 . But then we live in a camping trailer out in the woods ... with a little luck I'll get trusses up today on our new place .. It's clad with plywood , will be wrapped with 30 lb felt and hav e all double glazed windows . I hate being cold .
I've heard that hay bales around the skirting helps a LOT, in keeping the cold wind out from under your trailer. I should do some thing here, but suspect that hay bales won't be accepted by the management.
I skirted this place with 1" foam building insulation . Helps a lot . I also cover all the windows with clear plastic - though the biggest problem is that the aluminum windows have no thermal break in the frames , so they sweat no matter what if it's cold out . I have a 250w halogen light under there to help keep it above freezing so the holding tanks don't freeze which also makes the floor a little warmer .
Why not just install one of those small recirculating pumps (Watts is the mfg) that keeps your hot water at the tap. Pretty ingenious the way it works. Small valve at the point(s) farthest from the water heater which causes the hot water being pumped to that faucet to backfeed into the cold water side - creating a closed loop. Water on the cold side (throughout the pipe run) stays tepid and when you turn on the hot water, you have hot almost instantly.
I installed the system in my home because I thought it would be nice not having to stand around waiting on my heated tile bathroom floor for the hot water to reach me.
No problem here with pipes freezing due to the locations of the runs but if I did, this would surely cure it and, likely, be cheaper and more effective in the long run than wrapping the pipes with heat tape.
The pump system is
SM: That sounds wise. I should do that. i've also considered that I can get free cardboard, all I want. I've toyed with the idea of nail and staple cardboard up from under. Not sure how humid it is under, the cardboard might all turn to mildew.
SM: when it was cold the other night, my outer panes had frost, from my indoor humidifier. Seems like there has to be some way to put some foam on your window frames, to keep the cold out.
I have a 250w halogen light under
SM: That runs up your electric bill. But, what you going to do? Better than freeze damage. In my old advanced elderly, decrepit age, I get cold feet easy. I've got a couple extra carpet samples in key places like next to the bed. Helps me in my struggle to keep my feet warm. I discovered this by accident, one time. I was living in a masonry building with cement floor. one foot was warm, and the other was cold. I looked, and found the warm foot was on double carpet, the cold foot was on single carpet.
This is recommended up here in the PNW whenever we get a lengthy cold snap (as we are getting now). The idea is that a little flow somewhere in the house keeps the water moving, and prevents freezing/ruptured pipes.
Just read one such recommendation a few days ago, actually.
Never done it myself, and have never had any trouble (I do cover the outside hose bib, however).
Jon
I am familiar with the concept that running water does not freeze. That still leaves the question of what the OP means by "dripping". I could take a faucet apart, deform the washer or nick the seat and cause the faucet to drip even when fully turned off. However, will that be enough to prevent freezing? I don't know, because I don't know how much the OP wants the faucet to drip.
As I said earlier, there are lots of details the OP should be sharing if (s)he wants a definitive solution to the problem.
Did you miss the part where I said I'm living in a camping trailer ?
-- Snag
You're sure about that? Frozen water doesn't run...but that's confusing cause and effect.
Dripping the faucet has nothing to do with flow. It's all about the thermodynamics of putting heat in faster than it radiates to keep the temperature above freezing. If you have a source of unfrozen water running at a rate that gets it to the dripping faucet before radiation/conduction/convection causes the water to freeze at any point in the pipe you're good to go.
Dripping the bathroom faucet typically won't do much for the kitchen pipe.
Dripping is most effective when you have a short run of pipe that's exposed to the cold, but the rest is much warmer. If you have a quick response thermometer, you can do the experiment. Let the system sit for a while. Then turn on the faucet and watch the temperature. You'll see where the pipe is most exposed to the cold as a function of time.
When I replaced the water service, I discussed the issue with the inspector. He insists that water meters don't freeze, even tho they're much more exposed than the rest of the buried pipe. When I started talking thermodynamics, his eyes glazed over. ;-)
That
No, it's two separate things.
Yes it does. Dripping at the faucet causes and is equivalent to flow. from where the water enters the house to where it drips. Whetther the drip rate is enough or not to keep t he water from freezing doesn't change that.
True, but if the water spends less time in the pipe, it has less time to radiate heat. If there is no drip, it can spend 16 hours or more at a time in the same spot of the pipe. Much more if the kitchen isn't used. If it's dripping, it might only spend 10 minutes, or 3 hours, but still less than without a drip.
My friends bought a new house and the first winter a pipe running up to the second floor, right by the back door, froze and leaked. When they opened the wall, they saw the insulation had been put on the wrong side of the pipe.
True.
Of course not. I don't think he was suggesting that. I thought he was trying to get the pipe that is dripping not to freeze.
From this paragraph on, I think we are agreeing.
Do you think he's right. I don't have a water meter and neither do my 100 neighbors, so I have no experience with them.
Running water doesn't freeze because:
In this case, a running faucet doesn't freeze because or #2. The water doesn't stand in the cold part of the pipe long enough to cool off the freezing point. If the "drip" doesn't move enough water to keep the temperature above the freezing point, it will freeze. The fact that the water is moving is irrelevant.
Insulating the pipe is the correct solution.
Insulating the pipe is usually a good thing. It may be the solution. If the water is not moving and bringing in more heat, insulation will just mean it takes longer to freeze. It may be that there's enough conduction thru the water and the pipe from a part of the pipe in a warm environment to keep the temperature up. But insulation on the warm part of the pipe reduces that effect. Most home dwellers won't have the knowledge to figure out the fine details.
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