The wife loves when I clean the toilets using the patented huckleberry method devised by Oren of pouring concentrated pool acid into the tank, so, she asked me to clean the pots and pans ("for once").
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Being a believer in the magic of alchemy, I dutifully pour the HCL: blob:
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This muriatic acid bubbles and froths quite reassuringly, as if it's doing something useful:
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But the end result is less than spectacular:
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It seems the metal *under* the baked-on crud was worn away, leaving the crud!
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On the inside of the pot, it just seemed to pit the insides like sandpaper:
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The result of all that hydrochloric acid was a large vase of pretty green "something" ... but what is this green something made out of?
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More importantly, what is my next magic chemical to try?
What the heck is in the pot? Did something overcook and burn? I've cleaned a couple of burnt pots by putting dishwasher detergent and boiling few minutes, then soak overnight. They are 50 years old and still look like new.
A toilet is made of porcelain which does not react to the hydrochloric acid , while the mineral deposits very actively react with it. That's why it do esn't damage the toilet and works. Those pots are made of metal, which wil l react with the acid, while the burnt on food, while somewhat reactive, is probably not highly reactive, depending on what it is. That's the chemistr y of why it didn't work.
If you burn food badly in a pot, put an inch of water in it, more if needed to cover it all, add a few tbsp of dishwasher powder, put it on the stove and let it simmer for an hour.
As we know from my extensive experiments with *every* household chemical known to mankind, NOTHING (bar none!) you can buy at any hardware store or supermarket cleans toilets like concentrated pool acid!
Anyone who thinks otherwise has never tried it. :)
Thank you for that explanation as to why the baked-on crud didn't bat an eye when enveloped in HCl.
Interesting suggestion. I don't have dishwasher powder handy, but laundry detergent should be the same stuff as shampoo, dish detergent, and laundry detergent are mostly sodium sulphates (e.g., sodium lauryl sulfate, sodium dodecyl sulphate, etc.).
Again, I eschew the weakness of common household chemicals, so, I admit I'm different in that I just love the power of the industrial stuff.
Is a sodium sulphate locally available in concentrated form by the gallon?
I thought of the oven cleaner foam, but really, I dislike the weak chemicals that are found in a supermarket, or even nowadays, in California, the "baby chemicals" that are available in the hardware stores.
I wish I had access to a chem lab which has concentrated sulfuric acid and sodium hydroxide both of which are like syrup as I recall from my college days long ago.
So the trick is to find a local industrial supplier where I can buy a gallon of sodium hydroxide.
What industry uses sodium hydroxide by the gallon?
The pots were basically "abused" by me (according to my wife) because I used them to make potato wedges for the grandkids, who love my potato wedges!
I would parboil the potatoes, cut them into wedges, soak the wedges in cold water, whip up a mix of flavored flour, tamp down the wedges a bit with a towel, and then put the wedges and flavored flour in a baggie to shake shake shake.
Then I'd freeze them (dunno why freezing works, but it does), and then when ready, I'd pop them into 400 degree F boiling oil in those pots.
Invariably there'd be splashes, fires, and spills, where the end result was those pots.
The only bases I have in any concentration are 5-pound bags of baking soda (sodium bicarbonate). Does that stand a chance of working?
I'd love to try sodium hydroxide but where, in California, locally, can I pick up a bottle of concentrated sodium hydroxide like I can do with pool chemicals?
Thanks for not screaming "You're gonna die!" and for suggesting a powerful alternative to fueling a complete aisle of uselessly dilute chemicals at the local supermarket.
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"Non-butyl, extra heavy duty detergent degreaser formulated for use in industrial and institutional facilities. Excellent kitchen and restaurant degreaser. Extra degreasing boost cuts though greasy build-ups and heavy encrustations."
Hmmmmmnbmm... what is it made of? "Contains no butyl or toxic solvents. No abrasives. No harmful vapors. No butyl kickback. Non-flammable. Biodegradable. Kosher and Pareve.".
Ummmmhmmm. Ok... so it's Kosher. But what is it made up of?
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" Causes severe skin burns and serious eye damage. May be corrosive to metals. Harmful or fatal if swallowed. May cause immediate pain. Destroy contaminated clothing."
Good! Now we're talking! :) Reading on...it's mostly water as the diluent with the following chemicals:
- Sodium metasilicate 5% to 10%
- Sodium tripolyphosphate 1% to 5%
- Potassium hydroxide 1% to 5%
- Phospate ester 1% to 5%
Googling for what the second-most main ingredient (other than water) does, we find Wiki says it's also known as "water glass" although there is only one sentence about it being a "detergent auxiliary".
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This gives a better explanation that it's a "water softener" which is used in common dishwasher laundry packets:
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Hmmmmnnmmm... maybe the second ingredient isn't the clincher since a water softener isn't all that big of a deal, especially if I can get it out of a common diswhasher detergent packet.
Moving to the third ingredient then, Sodium tripolyphosphate is apparently the phosphate in your basic detergents used as another water softener:
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Basically they make water more effective by "chelating calcium and magnesium ions".
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I think I'm looking for something more directly dissolving of the baked-on fats than a simple water softener.
To that effect, I do note my favorite, sodium hydroxide next on the list, but the question always was how to get a gallon of NaOH which I'd love to have at my disposal.
I think I mentioned before that strong acids and bases will react with aluminum etching it and generating hydrogen gas which is the foam. The aluminum salts of both are colorless but there may be something in the stain turning the froth green.
Baking soda is safe to use. You have burned in stains which are basically carbon that would have to be mechanically removed.
My advice is to ditch the pots and buy new ones and don't abuse them. Coated cookware with Teflon or other finishes works great until worn out. Only cookware that lasts forever is stainless steel or cared for cast iron.
Google is your best source and you will get tons of hits like this:
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I suspect your pots have been too abused to completely recover them. Even stainless steel scrubbers will abraid softer aluminum. Things wear out.
She accuses me of abusing things all the time. She just doesn't understand men.
Yup. The kids loved the flames! And the CO2 fire extinguisher whooosh! Whoosh! Whoosh!
I ruined the vent to the stove in fact, because the flames burned the wires even though the (asbestos?) wire-mesh shield (that's a project to fix for later).
Ummmmm.... er ... how do I say this without offending the (very very very Italian wife) ... but um ... there is only ONE type of oil in the kitchen.
Yes. One. Only one. It comes from Costco and not in a two-pack either.
OK. But isn't oven cleaner just extensively diluted perfumed sodium hydroxide? I'm not the guy for sissy stuff that supermarkets sell! :)
Besides, Frank said that concentrated sodium hydroxide won't work.
That's an idea! Heat alone might work. Of course, heat is what caused the problem in the first place... So ... um... dunno. But something makes self-cleaning ovens work.
I suspect they bake the fats to a crumbly crust.
I think my next step will be the pressure washer though. Or the goopy laundry detergent bath.
I was hoping for a magic chemical but Frank said NaOH isn't it. Certainly HCl isn't it.
Draino was basically sodium hydroxide, with some other minor stuff mixed in. That should screw up those pots more, especially if they are aluminum. In fact, I think Draino had/has some aluminum tiny aluminum chips in it to react, make heat and get it going.
Its also very high pH and prolonged contact can attack aluminum.
Even one drop of 1% caustic in the eye if not immediately washed out can lead to blindness by clouding of the lens.
I've worked with all these things in the lab where I have maximum protection if need like gloves, clothing, googles or face shield and good ventilation. Bringing concentrated acids or caustics into the kitchen to use can cause disaster if precautions are not taken.
There's something in the aluminum pots which turns the HCl emerald green. Maybe Fe?
Everyone says to use Baking Soda for almost everything but nobody knows how (or if) it works.
Baking soda is just sodium bicarbonate.
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It always amazes me that most people (not chemists) say to use baking soda for almost everything but not one of them knows how it works (or even if it works). I suspect 99% of the time it doesn't work.
Somehow, they think baking soda does something that sodium bicarbonate can't do.
Wiki says it's just a minor scouring agent, which if the point was to do physical labor, the pots would have been cleaned by someone else already. :)
Naaaah. That wouldn't be any fun.
I own a sand blaster, but I'm gonna try the more gentle pressure washer next.
Basically, all I really need though, is a carbon solvent.
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