But haven't we read here????

[terry]

This is in reference to "Double tapped circuit breakers" in main panel (North America).

In reference to more than a single wire on circuit breakers not designed for that.

In House Home Repair. dot com one reads .................

"So what can you do? If you aren't having any problems with the circuit being over-loaded the fix is really simple assuming the two wires are the same gauge. Simply disconnect them from the breaker, add a pig-tail of the same gauge wire, connect the three wires together and secure the pig-tail to the breaker. A splice inside the box is allowed and you now meet code and have satisfied the home inspector for about a dollar.

But haven't we read here that pig tailing within the circuit breaker panel is not to code? Or not to SOME codes?

We happen to have Square D breakers in three panels; main and two pony. And, seemingly, for 40 years no problems at all! And with occasional changes over the years and to re-balance loads between Leg and leg B etc. I'm sure there is the odd pigtail or two!

Just curious?

[dpb]

...

...

Unless it's been changed in late versions afaik NEC doesn't prohibit it (assuming all the caveats of proper minimum wire size(s), not excessive total loads, etc., etc., etc., ...).

Of course, localities can have any additional restrictions they wish above NEC so I'll certainly not say you won't find someplace that doesn't allow same.

And, of course, there's nothing to say that any given inspector isn't fully capable of rejecting any even somewhat unusual finding simply because it isn't as expected as opposed to being an actual violation.

--

[hallerb]

and come home sale time a home inspector will be looking with glee, not only does finding this verify to the buyer he was money well spent but you will ewither be rewiring or giving a discount on the home equal to the rewire costs

[dpb]

[e-mail] wrote: ...

Oh, bs, haller... :(

Quote pertinent NEC, please instead of spouting your doom'n'gloom everything hangnail is a disaster crap.

[Colbyt]

Thank you for referencing my article:

At the time that was done there were no restrictions on pigtails inside the breaker box. I don't believe there are now in my area. Local codes always prevail.

It should satisfy almost all home inspectors and if there have been no problems over the years then that is the only thing you need be concerned about. My current breaker box in my personal residence has breakers that can be double tapped if needed but I am sure I would have to dance through the same hoops if I had any and were selling. Some times you just need to dance.

[David Nebenzahl]

On 6/3/2010 1:52 PM dpb spake thus:

Really. Time to put up or shut up.

[hallerb]

At home sale time the BUYER is making what is most likely the LARGEST SINGLE PURCHASE OF THEIR LIFE.

Sure you may be able to justify it somehow but if it appears hacked.

gets the buyer wondering what else isnt up to par.??? maybe better to look elsewhere?

the home inspector is hired by the buyer to run the price down.

hey its your money if you want to get less for your home its no money out of my pocket:)

[Doug Miller]

In article , terry wrote: [...]

Yes, we have read that here. Repeatedly. And, oddly enough, the people making that claim, when challenged to cite which specific Code provision(s) prohibit the practice, have been unable to do so. Repeatedly.

[David Nebenzahl]

On 6/3/2010 3:40 PM [e-mail] spake thus:

Not ONE SINGLE THING you wrote is even the flimsiest form of evidence; just more of your blatherings.

Come back here when you can show us some PROOF. Until then, please f*ck off.

[bud--]

We have read here that pig tailing in a circuit breaker (or fuse) panel is explicitly allowed by the NEC (312.8). So is running wires through the panel that do not terminate there (could run through to an added subpanel for instance). There is a limit to how crowded the wiring spaces can be.

As the article (linked by Colbyt) says, many SquareD breakers are UL listed to have 2 wire connections - generally up to #10 wire. That, of course, does not mean a home inspector won't call it as a violation.

Is hallerb a home inspector?

[terry]

Thanks for the comments; pro, con and sideways ............... and for clearing that up .................. I think!

[hallerb]

No just have hassles with them.

Moostly I think they are honestly trying to do a good job.

but hey their job is to find problems.

and while a problem reported may be nothing it can make the buyer nervous.....

and cost you a sale

[dpb]

[e-mail] wrote: ...

... But, their job is not to make up stuff that isn't; too bad you don't follow the same credo... :(

--

[Oren]

It may have been a tax appraiser (I forget). He measured the side walls of the house. Instead of corner-to-corner, he walked down the slop and took his reading at a diagonal.

Me: How did my house get so big?