Well I certainly appreciate the clarification guys. Not attempting to ruffle feathers here, certainly not attempting to flame out the newsgroup. But when I hear something that doesn't make sense to me I ask, its what I do most of the day at the office so it's natural back home. Besides, what I've learned is that asking questions is the best way to understand and correct deficiencies, it might piss people off, might push them outside their safety zones, might even challenge conventional wisdom, but I'll walk away better educated.