I need to install a new 40A 220 VAC circuit for the incoming Whirlpool
range. My circuit box (yes, it's Federal Pacific, probably 25 years old,
but I'm not able to change it right now) is mounted on the outside rear wall
of the house, apparently with everything pulled up through the wall. How
does one safely fish 8ga. wire for the new circuit into the box from the
attic? Also, am I likely to find breakers to fit this thing at the local
Home Depot/Lowes (GE, Siemens, etc)?
Federal Pioneer (the Canadian arm of Federal Pacific) is still in business,
and in Canada the breakers are price comparable with other brands.
Try a Canadian mail-order house.
www.schneider-electric.ca is a distributer.
to mailorder them.
Chris Lewis, Una confibula non set est
It's not just anyone who gets a Starship Cruiser class named after them.
40 amps for an range? Most ranges I have installed were 50 amps.
Please hire this work done. The questions your asking are way to simple. You
should not be working around a hot bus if your not experienced.
Personally I would be buying an new service before the range.
No, really. The layout of this box has all of the lines from the house
pulled through a single hole in the brick through a knockout in the back of
the box, right behind the incoming hot service lines. Probably wired by the
original mass-production house contractor before the drywall went up. No
strain reliefs, no separate knockouts, no protection of the lines at
all--I'm probably lucky if its watertight with the wall.
Thanks for the information. A compatible 2-pole 40A breaker is selling for
60USD on this side of the border, and many of the online dealers are selling
reconditioned parts for that. The conduit up the outside of the wall idea
sounds like a reasonable solution for now. I think the whole mess needs to
be replaced as soon as possible.
I've seen this in a couple of homes in Florida. All homeruns come through a
single 2" knockout in the top of the box with no romex connectors at all. Just
a 2" PVC pipe connector to serve as a grommet.
Inspectors in Fla must accept this I suppose. Wouldn't fly around here, but I
doubt that timesaver is really dangerous it's not like those cables are
flapping in the breeze.
This is the exception to 312.5(C) they are using. I bet they are cheating on at
least one of these rules.
Exception: Cables with entirely nonmetallic sheaths shall be permitted to enter
the top of a surface-mounted enclosure through one or more nonflexible raceways
not less than 450 mm (18 in.) or more than 3.0 m (10 ft) in length, provided
all the following conditions are met:
(a) Each cable is fastened within 300 mm (12 in.), measured along the
sheath, of the outer end of the raceway.
(b) The raceway extends directly above the enclosure and does not penetrate
a structural ceiling.
(c) A fitting is provided on each end of the raceway to protect the
cable(s) from abrasion and the fittings remain accessible after installation.
(d) The raceway is sealed or plugged at the outer end using approved means
so as to prevent access to the enclosure through the raceway.
(e) The cable sheath is continuous through the raceway and extends into the
enclosure beyond the fitting not less than 6 mm (1/4 in.).
(f) The raceway is fastened at its outer end and at other points in
accordance with the applicable article.
(g) Where installed as conduit or tubing, the allowable cable fill does not
exceed that permitted for complete conduit or tubing systems by Table 1 of
Chapter 9 of this Code and all applicable notes thereto.
FPN:See Table 1 in Chapter 9, including Note 9, for allowable cable fill in
circular raceways. See 310.15(B)(2)(a) for required ampacity reductions for
multiple cables installed in a common raceway.
OK let me see it I understand this.
Somebody posts an electrical question that raised a few eyebrows. Tom
responds with a code section that was most likely used to justify the
installation. So Tom gets slammed because you can't come up with a
One of the problems with DIY is that there a lot of people doing stuff
they shouldn't. There a lot of people out there wiring stuff that they
shouldn't . They seem to think that just because they turn on the
breaker and nothing blows up that everything is fine. Just because
something works doesn't mean that it is wired correctly or that the
install meets code or is safe.
Geez we are all trying to help each other here. So if someone takes the
time to post a code section so be it. maybe we can all learn
I think some people feel that codes just drive up the price of a job .
People that think that way should realize that codes protect Us by
guarantying a safe installation.
This is Turtle.
Be Quiet now for we are setting this house up to burn it down ourself and don't
need any help doing it. If we read the code books the fire may never get started
like it is suppose to.
Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.
Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com ).
"Taking the time to post a code section" and sitting at home
obsessing about it are two different things. The question at
hand didn't call for a code compliance report complete with
speculation about how/why the person's municipality was
allowing the situation to exist.
There are a couple of people on this group who feel the need
to ram code down people's throats whether they need it or not.
They need to learn about speaking when spoken to, as the old
Is it typical of this group to start a thermonuclear flame war for every
The electrical code information/interpretation is certainly of interest, but
has to be taken in context. The house was built about '79 as part of a
subdivision of cookie-cutter houses, and clearly code compliance (especially
post-turn-of-the-century) wasn't weighing heavily on their minds---more
likely dwelling on a can of Skoal and a cold beer----
HomeOwnersHub.com is a website for homeowners and building and maintenance pros. It is not affiliated with any of the manufacturers or service providers discussed here.
All logos and trade names are the property of their respective owners.