Fewer American-made tools - yet another downside to illegal immigration and workers in the USA?

You make better points!

Reply to
Tom Disque
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"Tom Disque" wrote

Fanks. Tossing folks a bone now and then is always a good idea.

--Ted

Reply to
Edward M. Kennedy

Sorry - many people who work today have to work long and hard hours and their lives aren't their own. Most people have to not only get this certification apart from work, but they also have to pay for it on their own too! Someone who is told that they have to work tonight (when they should be going to their certification class) or they don't have to come in the next day has a tough choice to make. Getting your certification on the job is so much better.

And it's tougher to pay for that very expensive certification if you don't have a job - that is some expensive shit! You can't even get the State to pay for it in a reasonable period of time - let's say taking classes at the McKimmon Center - because the classes are so much more expensive than at Wake Tech - where it will take a lot longer to complete the course work.

Since few employees have the bargaining strength these days (relative to their employers) to negotiate for paid on the job training, unions do help with that. Name me a profession that isn't unionized that have apprenticeships? And don't say medicine, because that is apples and oranges.

Reply to
USENET READER

SO who signed your diploma saying you graduated from college, or certified that the college you went to was worth a damn? Or is that an OK monopoly in your view?

Reply to
USENET READER

Very few - about the only thing that I can see is the incorporation of lasers into saws to aid in cutting.

There are some lighter-weight tools out there today because of the use of magnesium, high-strength plastics and other lighter materials in the higher end tools. The light-weight plastics and metals in cheaper tools are very flimsy and don't stand up to heavy-duty use.

There are a lot more cordless tools out there, but most won't stand up to the daily grind, which is why you see corded tools on all but a few construction sites. Handymen tend to use them because the set up and tear down is easier, since they do it so much more frequently.

Reply to
USENET READER

Two - though their apprenticeships aren't formal training.

- electronic technicians

- machinery mechanics. (They instead depend upon years of exposure to different types of malfunctioning "gear", including poorly-written software.)

No training classes can prepare these individuals for what they may encounter. In fact, both are similar in a lot of ways to your "medicine" example, where diagnostic skills can come only from lengthy exposure/experience.

Reply to
Dweezil Dwarftosser

Jimmy Hoffa was a very personable fellow also -- doesn't mean he wasn't a crook.

Reply to
Gregor

I duno, I never looked at it.

Why bother? It wasn't! From grade school on, anything I learned was pretty much up to me. If I wished, I could've casted all the way thru college. Lucky for me, I enjoy learning.

Is what an OK monopoly? College certification boards?

Reply to
Tom Disque

"USENET READER" wrote

Crime me an anecdotal river.

For *you*.

Firmly grasping the obvious...

...until now. Software certification is free/cheap.

Plenty of employers *do* offer it if it is related to work. Care to back up your implied (sneaky, aren't we?) claim that few employees have access to on the job training?

If you say so. Ironically, computers were the classic type of learn-as-you-go work, though not as much now. Just about every type of construction effectively works that way. You don't take carpentry classes. You start as a helper. Same for aliminum siding, roofing, sheetrock, etc. Electricians do the formal version even where their aren't unions.

Lawyers, engineers, brokers, etc. start in junior positions. Management in general is trains & grooms as you go. It's a very common model, whether it is a formal apprenticeship or not.

--Ted

Reply to
Edward M. Kennedy

Grain of Sand is free to start his own college certification board. Zen University, Buddha College, The Socratic School of Sophistry...

--Ted

Reply to
Edward M. Kennedy

The difference between unionized apprenticeship programs and just company apprenticeship programs is standardization. Of course the ojt occurs a bit differently depending on the respective industry, but the classroom training is pretty much standardized in unionized apprenticeship programs.

Reply to
GFRfan

Reply to
GFRfan

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