Roundup or Weed B gone or...?

[jJim McLaughlin]

Portland Oregon area.

I need to kill a lot of weeds in a 24' x 16 ' rectangular bed quickly and then replant by

15 May with both seed plant seeds and starter plants.

Vecause of illness last fall, I didn't get te weed fabric covering on, so I have more weeds than I can shake a stick at.

These are going to be veggies.

After the weeds are killed, 'll shoveling on 62 Cu. Ft. of composted grass clippings and dried brown leaves that have been "cooking" for about 4 - 5 years.

The compost and the dead weeds will be rotilled in before new plants are introduced.

Weed B Gone?

Roundup?

Other ideas?

(Don't say hand weed. Not an option. Remnants of heart issues fom last fall.)

TIA.

[Travis M.]

Weed-Be-Gone will only kill broad leafed weeds it will not kill grass so if you have grass also use Round-Up.

[JoeSpareBedroom]

No chemical has ever or will ever be tested for safety in humans. Hire a neighborhood kid to hand weed the area. Or, your heart may end up being the least of your troubles. If you don't know any kids to ask, call the nearest high school and find out if they have a way of connecting kids who want jobs with people offering work.

[Rudy Canoza]

Roundup (active ingredient glyphosate) is a complete herbicide. It kills, or is intended to kill, everything to which you apply it.

Weed-B-Gon from Ortho is intended to kill weeds in lawns while not harming the grass. Its active ingredient (Triclopyr) is a selective systemic herbicide that affects woody and broadleaf plants.

You can find probably more information that you ever wanted on both of the chemicals at the Extoxnet site:

(for glyphosate) and (for triclopyr).

[zxcvbob]

Assuming the ground is not compacted too bad, I would spray it with Round-Up, plant my garden *without* tilling, and use the compost for mulch. 62 cubic feet sounds like a lot, but it will cover your area a little less than 2 inches.

I wouldn't till it because that will awaken dormant weed seeds that are just waiting for the ground to be disturbed. Let the earthworms till it for you. (or till it next year after you've gardened it for a year and kept it weeded by hand)

Bob

[Travis M.]

I have used

to find help with odd jobs.

[jJim McLaughlin]

Its not, it was tilled back last October, bu never got the cover down. Soil is still real wet as is typical of our springs. I used to add 4 fifty pound sand sacks each year too help drainage, and aid the compost in breaking up the clay, but that may not be an option this year.

The three 10 gallon buckets of ash from the wood stoves over a winter's heating season are already out there.

I would spray it with

The compost operation is three 4' x 4 ' x 4' chicken wire bins, rotated and tossed a lot. Its amazing how full one looks when its all "cooked" and ready, and how little there is when it is spread.

Both the garden plot and the compost are teaming with worms. I like worms. (Neighbors think I'm wierd.)

If the grand kids were here (Oregon) instead of Virginia, they'd be learning that the "funnest" use of worms is fishingn not farming.

My concern re the Roundup is that as I understand it it is not a soil sterilant, and thats the way I want it to be, i.e. kill the crap and not sterilize the soil.

G*dda*n morning glory blows in from across back fence neighbor's yard and I hate it, hate it, hate it, do you hear!

(Did I tell you some eighbors think I'm wierd?)

Thanks for ideas.

[John Bachman]

You are dealing with 3 different situations and looking for one solution. It does not exist.

Roundup will kill all growing vegetation, regardless of weed, grass or veggie.

Weed-B-Gone will kill all broadleaf growing vegetation but will not affect grasses.

Neither of those will affect ungerminated weed seeds in the ground waiting their time. You need a pre-emergent herbicide (Dacthol or Dactrinol for instance) to do that but it will also kill any veggie seeds that you plant for the next month or so.

So, you makes your choices and pays your price.

Be sure to read the label of whatever you choose and follow its instructions to the letter. Do that and there is little danger to those who consume the produce contrary to the beliefs of those who consume insect larvae in their veggies and fruits.

John

[jJim McLaughlin]

SNIPS

Nice post. Thanks.

I'm not worried about ungerminated weed seeds.

Those I can deal with on an ongoing basis.

Do that and there is little danger to

ROTFLMAO.

So true.

Good comment.

[Ann]

John Bachman expounded:

While I don't have insect larvae in any of my veggies or fruit (contrary to your misinformation) I'd rather eat them than produce doused in chemicals.

[Lar]

If you mean humans used as pesticide "test animals" sure they have. Several not too distant studies are around on different products. EPA had quit accepting such data only as recent as 1998 for regulatory purposes on pesticides. So it's ethical to admit such studies on chemicals used as pharmaceuticals which may only effect a small part of the population and unethical for the same type of studies on another chemical that by it's usage may effect a much larger percentage of the population because it is called a pesticide.

Lar

[zxcvbob]

It's a matter of degree, doncha think?

Bob

[JoeSpareBedroom]

To some extent, yes. One reason we grow vegetables at home is because we can control what chemicals, if any, are used. We have no such control with vegetables we buy at the grocery store, unless we buy organic. But, even though we can choose what to spray, we have no reliable information on the safety of the chemicals, and we never will.

[John Bachman]

Absolutely. I know what I do on my property. I am trained and licensed to apply controlled substances and follow all of the rules (READ THE LABEL).

That is very different from what happens on a commercial farm where the owner is dependent upon the hired help doing the right thing. My experience is that farmers want their workers to do the right thing but that may or may not happen. On my place (and I sell some of my produce) it is done by the book because I am the guy doing it.

On the other side are the organic Islamists who believe that their way is the only way and every one else should be killed. BS.

I raise quality products using IPM methods and am proud of what I do and will not accept unreasonable criticism form the organic Islamists.

John

[William Rose]

???? This is incredibly offensive. You must be one of those inorganic Falwell-Robertson peckerwoods. Childish isn't it? Let's converse like adults.

- Bill Cloribus gustibus non disputatum (mostly)

[JustMe]

|In article , | John Bachman wrote: |> organic Islamists

|???? This is incredibly offensive..... |Let's converse like adults.

Fat chance! I just kill-filtered him/her or should I say, "It?" Why waste time responding to such pre-adolescent nyah-nyah? Weed-B-Gone! He's JohnREMOVED.

[Alex]

|On Fri, 27 Apr 2007 16:35:25 -0700, William Rose

|wrote: | | |In article , | | John Bachman Alexander Miller,Vancouver Island; Zone 7(8?) Shallow topsoil, blue clay beneath. Soggy winters, baked dry summers. Using mostly raised beds :)

[Persephone]

For some people, it is a matter of religious practice. I learned, on last trip to Israel, that people who keep very Kosher will buy only bagged greens that have a certification. Meaning that they have been washed so thoroughly that no living critters are left on the greens.

Persephone

[Persephone]

RECENTLY

as 1998 for regulatory

AFFECT

a small part of

ITS

usage may effect

AFFECT

a much larger percentage of the

Sorry - I had one of those attacks. Helpless when the grammar grips me.

[Travis M.]

No amount of washing will remove e-coli.