germination and seedlings

I was wondering if anyone else had the same observation as I have. I use a soil that is specifically for germination (high sphagnum moss content I think) and it seems to do a good job of germination but then the seedlings seem to lack vigor. When I transplant the seedlings into larger vessels with "regular" potting mix, the plants suddenly become vigorous.

Anyone else have this experience?

Reply to
Billy
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You are probably not packing the soiless mix hard enough and the roots are weak from not having any resistance as they develop. I'm not saying to pack the mix hard or very tight, but firmed in before you put seeds on it, then cover the mix with the seed and if the seed needs dark to germinate just press that seed firm into the soil leaving it out to the light and water lightly. If the seed needs dark to germinate, still place seed on packed soiless mix and cover it with either vermiculite or more soiless mix. The mix is more likely milled vermiculite, not peat, but I don't know what you have there.

As a plus, make sure the mix is moist before you pack it into the flats or tray you are using. Most mixes have a wetting agent so the media will absorb better, but don't over water.

Reply to
Jangchub

My main problem has been getting light to the young plants. My cold frame helps a lot. Once up I plant outside as soon as possible so I am latter than most folks about here.

These sites have a bit of what your question is aimed at.

Just book marked them myself as I never thought to ask that question concerning best practice after germination.

Thanks!

Bill

Reply to
Bill

I have noticed the same thing. I am guessing that the germination soil has few if any nutrients since the seeds have everything they need for germinating. What do "they" suggest, transplant when the first set of true leaves appear?

Reply to
susan_r23666

"Billy" wrote

Exactly!

The starter I used, Magik-Moss Seed Starter is excellent, as far as composition, water retention and working form, but it seemingly has the nutritional value of shredded plastic. Next year I'll mix a couple of cups of alfalfa meal and a little bone meal with each bucket. That should green things up, as compared to the pale starts I was constantly chasing with nitrogen this year.

Steve Young

Reply to
Steve Young

Thanks for the reality check Steve and Susan. My own guess was that it was the sphagnum moss who's dampness kept the roots too cool, after they went outside, but who knows.

Thanks Bill for the informative web sites. And thanks to Jangchub for telling me where she thought I probably screwed up.

Reply to
Billy

To some degree yes. After moving to a new home, I've been trying to establish some new California poppies late in the season. I saw almost nothing growing from seed this late. I eventually tried Jiffy-7 "peat pellets" which are primarily sphagnum moss as well as square peat pots with potting soil (Miracle-Gro Moisture Control). The seedlings (germinated indoors) coming out of the pots (soil moderately packed) come up more slowly and smaller, but they seem stocky and strong. Most of the seedlings from the pellets are growing taller, but spindly with long stems sticking out underneath the base. One reason may have been when I kept them too long indoors. They seemed to get longer stems because they grew and leaned towards the sun coming from the window. Another part could be the fertilizer in the potting soil as well as the resistance to root growth from the packed soil. I move them outdoors to condition them to the sun, but some seedlings have died from the heat. I guess that's fine, since I'm trying to develop seedlings that won't just die when they get transplanted.

I did have one really nice example growing from a pellet, that I've since transplanted to a pot. That one I germinated in a different area, and took it outside as soon as I saw the taproot well established and before the stem popped up.

I have removed the netting from the pellets before transplanting. The peat pots I've watered and pulled back to keep the soil around the seedling intact. I've used plastic seedling pots, but I have a hard time getting them out without damaging the root. I also tried ripping the used peat pots into pieces to use as a soil amendment.

Just for fun I'm trying to sprout up some heliotropes from seed in the peat pellets. I'll see how that turns out.

Reply to
y_p_w

"Billy" wrote

I don't think so, as I had my starts sitting on a temp controlled 80 degree base with 480 watts of fluorescent lighting only inches above the 6 flats I started and I experienced the same deficiency you speak of. I was surprised at how much miracle grow I had to push at them to keep them greened up.

As valuable as new starts are, I constantly errored on the side of too little. Once I moved them outside and planted them, they snapped right to my expectation of fertile and healthy.

One thought I had as I was going through the period is that it much resembled the nitrogen deficiency one experiences when new bark mulch is put onto a planted flower bed.

Steve Young

Reply to
Steve Young

I don't have your wattage but mine were on a hot pad under grow lights and they germinate well. The only real problems I've had with germination this year were a couple of medicinal herbs (black cohosh and jaiogulan) and some errant mice nibbling the peppers:o()

The thing with my seedlings is that even when fish emulsioned and moved outside into full sun, they still lacked vigor (I wait for more growth before planting. My garden isn't for sissy plants.). They only perked up when they were re-potted with regular potting soil making up the additional volume of the pot or when they where planted in the ground.

Oh little mysteries of life.

Again, thanks for the observation.

Reply to
Billy

Yes, I get the same observation.

I start seedlings in small one inch pots. After germination about %80 percent for most of my plants. Then I transplant with potting soil in 5 inch pots. I transplant the seedlings just after the true leaves arrives. I also cut off the lower seed leaves on many of the plants that seem to lack vigor after a week or so on the transplants, it seems to help the plants. When the weather gets nice the plants get planted outside.

Billy, I know that you have far more knowledge about plants than I do.

Questions: Is something wrong with this observation? Is this processes the norm?

Enjoy Life ... Dan

Reply to
Dan L.

"Steve Young" wrote

Billy, here's what I did this year and the results were incredible. I used the same starter, as I liked it very well. To approximately 6 quarts of it I added 1 quart of my homemade compost, 1 pint of alfalfa meal, 1 cup of bone meal and 1/3 cup of green sand.

I potted up the flats and planted. Starting from the first watering I used

1 well rounded tablespoon of Soluble Root Growth Enhancer per gallon of water.
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I watered with this mixture 3 - 4 times through the 6 weeks they were under lights. When I took them outside to take in sunlight and harden off, I gave them a couple of waterings with fish emulsion at about half the label recommendation.

These plants were twice the size of anything I have ever started, and healthy, oh my. The amazing thing is how nice the roots looked when I planted them. Though I used 3 inch square containers for the tomatoes and smaller for peppers, etc. none were root bound, as I would of expected for plants as large as they were.

Reply to
Bowtie

oops Billy, I haven't posted in so long I forgot to check my nym ;)

Reply to
Steve Young

I'll give it a try. Thanks.

Reply to
Billy

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