Table saw buying advice needed!!

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Hi, I'll be buying a new table saw to replace my POS Delta table saw model no. 36-600, that's kaput. I've narrowed my choices down to 4, 2 contractor saws that's more in my price range and 2 cabinet saws that I'd have to tighten my belt to afford.
The choices are:
-Grizzly G0444z -Grizzly G1023s -Grizzly G1023sl -General International 50-175 m1 left tilt, or General International 50-185 m1 right tilt, it can be viewed at http://www.redmond-machinery.com/general%2050-175.htm
Which one would you buy and why?
Thanks,
Tony
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You will get a ton of arguments both ways on right versus left tilt. I prefer the right tilt but either is fine. It is really just what you are used to. Both will do the job.
I am not familiar with the specific Grizzly models you have outlined but do know that General makes a very nice saw. I would get a cabinet saw though. I had a contractor saw and regretted not buying a cabinet saw. Eventually I sold my contractor saw and bought a Delta Unisaw and love it.
If you are a serious hobbiest or pro, go with the cabinet saw. You'll never have to buy another table saw.
Rob

contractor
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With the same choices, I bought the G1023sl but I think I would have been happy with any of the others you mention. If I had it to over again, I would have gone right tilt but outside of that, I don't regret the decision. Must admit though, I've never heard anything bad about a General.
Don

contractor
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Delta 36-600 POS??? Come on! Thats my saw! It makes some pretty good saw dust. :)

contractor
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stoutman said:

HEY! I've got one of those. With some tweaking, it has accurately cut a lot of wood. I've even ripped 400 linear feet of SYP in one session. in addition to innumerable sheets of ply, hardboard, MDF and sticks of oak, poplar, and SFP. My only complaints are the slightly undersized diameter arbor, which makes dado sets an exercise in vibration unless they are shimmed, the lack of a real spitter which can be constructed yourself, and that stupid ledge around the blade insert which makes zero-clearance inserts a real PITA to make.
The motors die frequently, however - I've gone through two. The original motor is NLA and the overpriced replacement they will send now is an utter POS. They removed the long abor shaft and the belt drive. The replacement is more like a chinese circular saw motor. You loose 1/4" of cutting depth, and the crappy jackshaft drive makes the stock flutter on the table top. It was so bad that I rebuilt the last motor myself, and threw the "new" motor in the garbage. This is the motor that now comes in the TS-300, which is otherwise identical to the older 36-600.
I now regret, however, not spending a little more at the outset for a 36-650 - or better. NO MORE non-standardized motors for me...
I have my eye on the General 50-185-M1L at a local dealer. Nice left tilt, 2HP motor, and a straight, solid top.
My other choice would be the Grizzly G1023SL with fence extensions.
FWIW,
Greg G.
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Tony -
Last month, SWMBO and I bought an 8 year old General 350, their right tilt cab saw. It came w/ a mobile base, a bies 52" com fence and bitchen' miter guage... for a grand.
A tablesaw is everything, and if you wait and look, you WILL find something worth having that'll last a lifetime - at your price. If you buy a good, cared for, used saw, you're letting someone else take the depreciation on a new saw. Stuff can go bad on saws, of course, but if you buy from an individual, small shop or the like, you can be pretty sure it hasn't been flogged. You may miss out on "that new tablesaw smell", but you'll still be ahead of the game.
I had been looking for a Uni/PM/Jet or General and did lots of research over the last 6 - months or so and got my saw last month; remarks for Jet were probably the most current and very positive - that deal that they had/have for the saw, long fence and router table/router is/was VERY seductive. PM, of course good, but also some remarks about fit, finish and service since they were purchased by the company that also owns JET - OK, that and 2 grand. Unisaw remarks were good, obviously a benchmark saw for wooddorkers, but questions about the X5 and quality control on new saws left me hesitant. The Delta X5 Tablesaws ARE going to be or ARE ALREADY made in Chaiwan, and I wouldn't buy ANY first year or so production run of anything (except the corvette)
In researching the saws, I called several service departments and tool repair shops, both dealer and independent, and asked "what died" on the saws. The most telling remark was most of the repair guys were at a loss to say when the last time they worked on a General, or what parts fail. Granted, there are ALOT more Uni's and PM's out there, especially this far west of Quebec (I'm in CA)so you do have to factor that part of it, but their silence spoke in volumes for me. The kicker? Arbor bearings are 8 bucks and a new arbor shaft is 13.
I may have gone overboard while looking around. I was toying with the idea of getting shipping weights and total costs for complete arbor/trunion/sector gear setups so I could figure out which saw had the goods. The Trunions on my General weigh more than my old contractor saw.
If you haven't searched the archives, there was a recent post about a GI TS, I don't know which one... But it's worth looking for. I'd also recommend that you get/read/steal "Tablesaw Magic" by Jim Tolpin - the guy's take on tablesaws and his breadth of knowledge are amazing. I've been making sawdust for a little while, but his book taught me a few tricks. I would also buy a dial indicator setup for tuning the saw and your other tools - Check out the Grizzly "President's Special" - I got it in my hand 3 days after I ordered, for under 25 bucks total.
I don't know where you are, but I also heard good things and would have liked to have seen a Bridgewood TS from Wilke - I think they are in Penn. They make both cab and contractor saws, so I'd suggest a look.
My General 350 passes the "nickle test" starting, stopping and ripping, even on the mobile base. I am very happy with my find and can still, I think, make out a whiff of "that new tablesaw smell" when the shop is very still. Everyone has an opinion, and that's mine. HTH!
John Moorhead Lakeport, CA
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john moorhead wrote:

Ahhhhhhhhhhhhhh! It does appear that someone is listening.

Can you point me to where you received this tid-bit of info? I'm just curious.
UA100
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wrote:

Many of us are. Finding a good used saw often becomes an exercise in futility. <G>
Barry
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B a r r y B u r k e J r . wrote:

Ahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh! But looking, that's half the fun. It's all how you wrap your head around it.
UA100
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wrote:

But when the fun reaches two years, and faced with adding a longer fence to a contractor's saw, it becomes a lot less fun. <G>
Barry
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B a r r y B u r k e J r . wrote:

Yes it does. I drove to the ends of the earth (OK, only to the bottom of the mountain, but still) to look at a saw that was supposed to be oh so splendiferous. It was the same POS saw I already have, wearing different paint!
The problem with used saws is that most people IME have no idea what they have, and can't describe it over the phone.
--
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Uni -
The folks at Woodcraft and Santa Rosa Tool in Santa Rosa, Ca both carry General. SR Tool is industrial and I trust their service and background more than a run of the mill woodcraft employee, but they both told me that after December and in early 2004 that the X5 tablesaws will start being produced overseas.
My local woodcraft is good, and the fellows there are generally knowledgable and SR Tool has always been johnny on the spot for other questions I've had, so...
John Moorhead Lakeport, CA

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On Sun, 18 Jan 2004 13:57:15 -0600, john moorhead wrote

I wonder if anybody has asked Delta directly about this to see what their take of this story is...
Wayne
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Uni -
The folks at Woodcraft and Santa Rosa Tool in Santa Rosa, Ca both carry General. SR Tool is industrial and I trust their service and background more than a run of the mill woodcraft employee, but they both told me that after December and in early 2004 that the X5 tablesaws will start being produced overseas.
My local woodcraft is good, and the fellows there are generally knowledgable and SR Tool has always been johnny on the spot for other questions I've had, so...
John Moorhead Lakeport, CA

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john moorhead wrote:

Thanks for the follow up.
UA100
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On Sun, 18 Jan 2004 6:48:50 -0600, Unisaw A100 wrote

The one I looked at last week was still all made in the US. Now, that may change, but at least the one's they are currently making are made with US motors, and in a US factory.
Wayne
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John, Did you ever find a better splitter yet? And did you figure out an improved method of dust collection yet? What style of mobile base do you have? Mine is on a three wheeled base with the third wheel a retractible one that is used to raise and lower the saw for movement.

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Thanks John, gives me more to think about, buying used may be an avenue to check out. By the way, I'm in Knoxville, TN.
Tony

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Smart choice on the General 350. I looked for months to buy a used PM66 (I'm in the same area as Tony in east TN) and nothing was found. I finally bought the PM66 made in McMinnville TN, but that was before Jet bought them out. I understand they are made the same way, though. A change in management (or one manager) can make bad changes to a good product. I guess buying a USA product (or even a Tennesssee product) had a little influence, but the PM66 is great and should last a lifetime, just like a General 350.
wrote:

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And yet, if you purchased this saw for $1000.00 from this gent who owned and used it for 8 years, did he really take any depreciation? If 8 years ago the price of the saw was $2000.00 (highly unlikely), he basically paid the same that you did. Probably, though, he only paid $1200-1500 for it; so in reality, he only paid $200-500 for it. A good deal for you, and a good deal for him.
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