Ping Domino guys

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On 1/26/2013 7:58 AM, Dave wrote:

And doing many things a biscuit jointer can't do. I don't own a Domino, but I'd have to agree, seeing the many uses Leon comes up for his.
Hell, if we took away Leon's SketchUp and Domino he'd have to get a job on a cable DIY show. ;)
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On 1/26/2013 8:29 AM, Swingman wrote:

Take those away and I would explode.
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On Saturday, January 26, 2013 7:58:26 AM UTC-6, Upscale wrote:
I'd argue with the above statement. The plate joiner is very good at aligning and edge gluing boards and plywood. Making a door panel, cabinet side, use the plate joiner. Aligns and adds a little strength. Extra strength not needed since its edge gluing, which are strong enough with nothing extra. Domino probably does a fine job too. If you use one of the wide hole widths you can not worry about exactly where you put the holes. But the plate joiner is quicker, lighter, easier to use. Its main purpose is to edge join boards.
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On 1/26/2013 12:35 PM, snipped-for-privacy@yahoo.com wrote:

seen this tool before, so I google'd it and it looks >impressive. If I understand it correctly, its basically a high-end >biscuit-type plug joiner. What I don't get is why is the dust >extractor such an expensive option. Does it blow air into the mortise >and then vacuums it out as well? If you're asking about the dust collector, it's as high end as the Domino tool itself. Much quieter that your regular screaming beast, very effective dust collection, tool activated power on function, very effective dust filtering. Naturally, there are others will forgo the cost for a $98 two hundred decibel animal. All I can suggest is to try on of the Festool dust collectors on their thirty day return guarantee program and then decide. Also, Festool offers a package reduction price if you buy the Domino and the dust collector at the same time

replaces the need for a biscuit joiner. Some might disagree with that statement, but I'm not one of them.

and edge gluing boards and plywood. Making a door panel, cabinet side, use the plate joiner. Aligns and adds a little strength. Extra strength not needed since its edge gluing, which are strong enough with nothing extra. Domino probably does a fine job too. If you use one of the wide hole widths you can not worry about exactly where you put the holes. But the plate joiner is quicker, lighter, easier to use. Its main purpose is to edge join boards.

By your statements above you have probably not used a Domino. The plate jointer makes a curved single thickness slot. The domino makes multiple thickness slots and every bit as effective in alignment as a plate joiner where a plate joiner is adequate. Any thing beyoned that the Domino is by far superior. The plate joiner is absolutely no faster than a domino and set up is absolutely not easier and for all practical purposes they both are in the same weight range for the same style plate joiner.
So use a plate joiner when "good enough" is good enough. If you want better up. down. and side to side alignment, and much more strength, go with the Domino.
Your few examples you listed are about are about all the plate joiner is decent for with one more exception, it makes a good slot for a lock lever to rotate into. With the Domino what you have listed above is only the beginning of what a Domino is good for.
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Thanks for the support. I'll get that $20 mailed to you right away. :)
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On 1/26/13 12:35 PM, snipped-for-privacy@yahoo.com wrote:

Shortly before I got rid of my plate joiner, I was having trouble getting it to "align" edge joined boards, as it seemed the fit of the biscuit in the slot was too loose. I could align the board as well by hand as with the biscuit. I was, in fact, using the proper biscuit and bit combination. I tried a different brand biscuit, but they were all the same.
I called the company to ask some questions about this. The tech support guy said the biscuits were compressed and purposely undersized so they would swell when dampened by the glue and make a tight joint. However, this would never happen before the glue set and hand alignment was still necessary.
So, to this day, I fail to see how biscuits help with alignment of edge joined boards, if I still have to "fine tune" the alignment by hand/clamp/cauls.
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On 1/26/2013 1:15 PM, -MIKE- wrote:

I had the same problems, with a 556 PC and 557 PC plate joiner, using PC, Freud, and who know what brand biscuits. Often the biscuit would have to be hammered in if I were to use it and not toss it. Other times it and the trim it was aligning would fall out of the slot if turned upside down before clamping. Slightly better than finish nails providing you did not want to hide nail holes.
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My experience ... During a glue-up, when TIME is of the essence, either panel or frame, you're looking for biscuits to get you into the alignment ballpark, both vertically as well as horizontally, much much faster with, than without ... NOT do all your work for you. :)
Also much much faster to get the clamps on a 45 degree joinery frame glue-up with biscuits, than without.
If you want accuracy, or strength and accuracy, use a Domino ... if you're pushed for time on a glue-up, biscuits can save your bacon without a lot of slipping around and futzing with basic juxtaposition, AND give you some degree of strength. (Sure, you can stop the slipping around during alignment with clipped off brads, but they're nearly as effective, overall, as biscuits)
YMMV ... But I like'm and use them often.
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On 1/26/13 2:05 PM, Swingman wrote:

That's kind of the impression I was left with. In my mind, I was thinking they did a lot more than they actually did. In reality, they didn't do enough for me. They are times when I want to use them again, like for this bookcase project, but that when I'll reach for my doweling clamp and drill for dowels. It may take a bit longer, but I get more accurate alignment and some strength.
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On 1/26/2013 3:02 PM, -MIKE- wrote:

I'm kinda surprised with the work you've been doing lately that you don't have a Domino.
I would love to have the 700, but I can't really justify the expense as long as I have the Multi-Router also ... and it is actually much more versatile, if much less convenient than a Domino. If the Domino's was about half the price to get fully into the game that they are (that damned systainer, with extra bits and full complement of dominoes ... ouch!), I wouldn't hesitate ... and I already own a CT22E Dust Extractor.
That said, I'm working up a bid on another chair job as we speak, so that just might change.
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On 1/26/13 3:42 PM, Swingman wrote:

Hang on.... my wife's right upstairs, say that louder so she can hear it! :-) We're thinking about a kitchen remodel and if we pull the trigger, I'll be Festooling up, including a Domino. She really likes the "Z-chairs" that they make to show the strength of the Domino joint. So, I'll be making some of those, too.
Of course, I don't know when I'll have time with all these high profile gigs of mine... <snort!>. :-)

Right on!
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Swingman wrote:

There ya go, age old technique. Get a job that the client ends up buying you the tool.
I remember years ago, for a number of years where almost all new tools were bought by clients. I had a line that went something like this. "Well, I would love to make that for you. I would charge this much for labor plus cost of materials. And I need a special tool to complete this particular project."
It worked most of the time.
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You know you want one. You know you're going to buy one. You just need to find the proper mind button to push you into paying for one.
I understand completely.
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Final report: This unit sold for $926. That's more than retail, although this one included some extra cutters and dominos. Wow.
On Sunday, January 27, 2013 2:04:44 AM UTC-6, Upscale wrote:

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For about 20% more you get an assortment of five different sized tenons, more than 1,000, 5 extra cutters, a systainer for the tenons, a new Domino and a 3 year warranty.
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On Tue, 29 Jan 2013 17:26:15 -0800 (PST), "Gramp's shop"
<heh heh heh> I refer you to the infamous P.T. Barnum quote.
-- All I want is a warm bed, a kind word, and U N L I M I T E D P O W E R ! --anon
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If, as he says, that he used the machine for only one project (and is wasn't abused), then that's a good deal. Since I've gotten my Domino - I've rarely used anything but floating tenons. I'll swear by it ....

I see he doesn't list the 6 mm cutter, and that's a part that I've found necessary. Also I've occasionally used 4 mm Dominoes. They will come in handy.
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On Thu, 24 Jan 2013 21:18:02 -0800 (PST), " snipped-for-privacy@aol.com"

Yes, that concerns me a bit and suggests that he's bought the bits and the Dominos separately from the kit. Or else, he's broken/lost/chipped those two missing bits.
Also, I couldn't tell from the picture if it was the older pin model or the newer paddle model of Domino.
Initially, it's cheaper in the beginning to buy the systainer set of Dominos which also includes a full bit set of Domino cutter sizes 4mm, 5mm, 6mm, 8mm, 10mm.
http://www.leevalley.com/en/Festool/page.aspx?pg968&cat=5,105,68330
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I see that the bidding is pretty active and there's a bit less than 4 days left ....
Let us know if you won the auction.
Also, there's a lot of available on-line tutorials, videos, and other information on using the Domino to its full potential.
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