Delta vs Steel City Table Saw

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Hello,
I have asked a few questions on here before and have been impressed with the wealth of knowledge you all have. I am currently in the market for a new table saw (my first actually) and have been shopping around. I have narrowed it down to two different saws, a Delta and a Steel City.
It seems every store I go into that sells Steel City and other brands HEAVILY recommends the Steel City. I just want to know what you guys think of them and maybe get any pros or cons you know of.
The Delta model is: 36-716B The Steel City is: 35670
Both have the same size motor and I feel the fences are somewhat comperable. I just don't know what I am missing...
The Delta saw is looking like it will be $999 - no rebates The Steel City is looking like it will be $949 - after $100 mail in rebate.
Both will require mobile bases.
Thanks for your time!
Adam
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You can get the Delta for 949 +6.50 shipping (yes, 6.50!) here: http://www.tools-plus.com/delta-36-716b.html

It's 849.99 (??shipping??) after rebate here: http://www.dynamitetoolco.com/Steel_City_35670_10_Cabinet_Table_Saw_p/stl-35670.htm
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wrote:

Steel City is a relatively new outfit, it has been getting a lot of good press; Delta and Powermatic cabinet saws have been the gold standard that other saws are compared to for a long time.
The saws you mention are not really cabinet saws, despite appearances.
That dynamite tool site lists a steel city cabinet saw with a 3 hp motor for for $950. In my opinion the extra hp makes a huge difference. You would need 220V to connect it, but I do think a "real" cabinet saw at that price difference should not go overlooked.
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Jim Weisgram wrote:

In what way is the Steel City not a "cabinet saw"?

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The SteelCity saw is a hybrid. One of the distinctive differences between a cabinet saw and a contractors is that the trunions on a contractors saw is hung from the bottom of the table where on the cabinet saw, the trunions are mounted to the cabinet and not connected to the top. SO...the hybrids have a cabinet like the cabinet saws but mount the trunions to the table.
Mike
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are
a
That's interesting information to know. It makes me think that if I ever have to move a cabinet saw, hopefully it would make it easier to remove the table from a cabinet saw to reduce weight as well as overall size.
As far as you know, is there any practical or beneficial reasons to not have the trunions attached to the table but instead attached to the cabinet?
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The table will remain flatter, since it's not supporting the entire drive train.
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wrote:

Yes, It allows you to expand the trunnion brackets to the four corners of the cabinet, giving you the opportunity to place a beefier yoke/trunion assembly and motor bracket in the mechanism. Hybrids that have a contractor saw style tie rod carriage assembly tend to be less robust.
Frank
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The Davenport's wrote:

Uh, what leads you to believe that the Steel City 35670 has table mounted trunions? Steel City thinks that they are cabinet-mounted. Most reviews comment on their being cabinet mounted. The web site linked above states specifically that "The precision-machined cast iron trunions are mounted to the cabinet". So I repeat my question. In what way is it not a "cabinet saw"?
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J. Clarke wrote:

Thank you for posting that as I was just thinking about the fact that the salesman has made such a big deal about it when speaking with him. Being new to this I didn't really understand why he was making such a big deal about it. So it seems like a pretty big deal :-)
This is the products main page: http://www.steelcitytoolworks.com/products_tools.cfm?section=2&category &tool5670
They say this:
"Cabinet Mounted Trunion System: The precision-machined cast iron trunions are mounted to the cabinet to ensure perfect blade alignment, increased stability and to eliminate vibration. "
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wrote:

What everyone has left out of this discussion, probably assuming that everyone knows, although your relative newness suggests you might not, is that Steel City is run by a bunch of old Delta people. Frank probably knows them all. While that by itself doesn't assure anything about the product, it at least suggests where the design has its roots.
One thing I found curious when I went to the link and saw the picture, is that the motor cover is on the right, as is usual with all the old right tilt Unisaws. Every left tilt cabinet saw I've seen (Delta's, Powermatic's, Jet's, etc.) have the motor cover on the left on a left tilt saw.
The arc on the front of the cabinet is left tilt-like, but the cover (and the tilt wheel, also on the left, as on a right tilt)) is throwing me off. At the very least that suggests some departure from just staid old Delta-ware (not that there was anything wrong with that). I hope someone can come up with the answer to that.
You do know they're built offshore, right? If that matters. Hard to avoid, in any event.
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LRod

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wrote:

For the sake of clarity, what has been labeled a hybrid cabinet saw in the past is a saw with trunnion brackets mounted to the bottom of the table and a tie bar trunnion carriage assembly. Essentially a contractor saw that has had the motor mounting relocated, maybe with the addition of a half HP, and an enclosed cabinet added. Dewalt also produces one that has a 3/4" cabinet, I believe.
The next step up was a cabinet saw that had wide trunnion brackets mounted at the four corners of the top plate of the cabinet with a very heavy, all cast iron trunnion yoke assembly. Top of the line Unisaw, PM66 (slightly different design here), General (Canadian) and far east imports Jet, Griz, and some other knockoffs.
The saw you depicted is a hybrid of a hybrid. Got the cabinet mounted trunnion brackets, but the trunnion carriage is a contractor tie bar style.
I would agree with the comments about increased stability and lessoning of vibration, however, the "perfect" blade alignment really depends on how well it is manufactured. Fact is that all saws can be adjusted to "perfect" at 90, but the differential at 45 then becomes the variable. It is slightly more difficult for the manufacturer to insure a limited differential with a cabinet mounted system. With the table mounted system, the table is machined and ground so the plane of the top compared to the plane of the mounting bosses has a capable range of a few thou. With a cabinet mounted system, the top plate of a cabinet is subject to the capable range of blanking, forming, and welding sheet metals, so that plane difference may be .020". Distances and projected dimensions come into play. If the manufacturer is sloppy with their sheet metal work, that 45 dimension is not going to be so hot.
The owner can always shim to "perfection" if inclined to do so, the manufacturer will not be able to take the time on an assembly line.
Above for information purposes only, I'll not comment on your choices, have not seen or used either of them. I know all the principles involved with Steel City, they are all ex-Delta and good product people. I know that they have made an effort to treat their distributors equitably so it does not surprise me that the dealers reccommend their product. But as to the product itself, you should do the necessary due diligence to compare.
Frank
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Frank Boettcher wrote:

One of the other features on that particular model is "Exterior Adjustment for 45 and 90 Blade Stops: Provides easy and accurate settings for the 45 and 90 positive stops."

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On Mon, 18 Feb 2008 09:36:18 -0500, "J. Clarke"
<snipped a bunch to address only the last comment>

Has nothing to do with 90 or 45 degree blade alignment to the slot which was the claim in the ad and was what I was addressing with my post.
Frank

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Frank Boettcher wrote:

Look again.
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On Mon, 18 Feb 2008 14:15:46 -0500, "J. Clarke"

Look at what. The portion of the Steel City web ad that the OP referred to had to do with "perfect blade alignment" as a result of "cabinet mounted trunions" That is what I was referring to and that has nothing to do with blade stops. That fact that it has exterior adjustable stops is nice, but not unique.
Frank
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Frank Boettcher wrote:

Then would you be kind enough to explain what you _did_ mean by "Has nothing to do with 90 or 45 degree blade alignment to the slot which was the claim in the ad and was what I was addressing with my post."
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On Mon, 18 Feb 2008 16:17:33 -0500, "J. Clarke"

90 degree alignment to the slot is the measurement of the blade to the miter slot on the table on a continuous basis along the entire length of the blade. The desired outcome is that there is no difference at any point.
45 degree is simply the same measurement taken with the blade tilted to 45 degrees.
Manufacturers don't actually use a blade, they use a ground, calibrated plate so as not to induce the tolerances of the blade into the setting or final check.
The stops you refer to are to set the blade tilt angle, either perpendicular to or at a 45 degree angle to, the table.
These are mutually exclusive items.
Frank
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Frank Boettcher wrote:

So how many saws have problems with your kind of alignment?
And do you actually work with wood or just argue interminably?

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On Mon, 18 Feb 2008 19:56:48 -0500, J. Clarke wrote:

Huh? Frank answered your question and you just keep on carping. I understood him the first time - maybe because I've seen saws with just that problem. Most of us probably have.
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