buying a dust collector

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"move suction" OK. If you have a shop vac and you are sweeping up dust just by using the end of the hose and no tools on the end, then you can "move the suction" to the end of the wands or another hose by adding it to the existing hose you are using.
If, however, you attach your hose to a large box and expect the "suction" to pick up dust at the opposing end of a larger opening, then the suction from the small hose (shop vac) will decrease and will not be enough to pick up dust.
Read the book "Connecting Woodworking Tools To A Dust Collector For Dummys" and you'll understand how to move the suction so it picks up the dust at the point where it is made.
-- Woody
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******** How My Shop Works ******** 5-21-03
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Could you describe what a well made port on the table saw looks like? You're the first person I've read that espoused using a 2 1/2" hose to collect dust from a table saw.
Bob

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You want to know how my TS dust hood is built? Well, I have no pictures, but I will try and describe it for you. And yes, it does use a 2-1/2" shop vac line from my DC
First off, I used 1/2" melamine faced particle board. I cut a shape much like a hip & ridge roof, only this was turned upside down to form a funnel with two flat sides. Then I cut the ridge (the long sides that came together) so that there was a small opening at a slant. (much like cutting an inch from one side and two inches from the other side) Then this left an opening that was perfect to fit a shop vac floor brush found at Lowes that had the brushes removed and duct taped tightly to the opening. The other end was hung from the sides of the saw stand using the same principal as the dust bag most WW stores sell for $40., only there was 4" of canvas used to the particle board from the saw stand.
Inside the unit there was a piece of 1/4" x 1/4" hardware cloth stapled down at a level just high enough to be the floor area when the door is open. This allows the door to be opened and small pieces removed so they don't get swept into the DC. I also use zero clearance blade plates, but not everytime do these prevent the small pieces from getting away.
A shop vac hose connected from the manifold to a blast gate on the side of the saw is placed when setting up the saw. There is a hose that is permanently connected from the blast gate to the floor brush and taped well with duct tape.
Like I said, I do not have any photos, so don't ask to see any pics. I just figured any WW'er would know how to build this.
--

Group: rec.woodworking Date: Fri, Dec 26, 2003, 1:48pm (MST+7) From:
snipped-for-privacy@earthlink.net (Bob=A0Davis)
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There are dozens of books and articles on dust collection that consistently state that the hazardous nature of dust in woodworking was not recognized several decades ago. So what's your point?

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My point. Today's dust is recognized and is stated to be a problem. Along comes a 4" port and this works well for small DC units, but when more tools are added, more power is needed to compensate for the leaks and hose runs. With the proper size ports, leak sealing and hoses, the extra power may not be needed.
--
Group: rec.woodworking Date: Fri, Dec 26, 2003, 1:53pm (MST+7) From:
snipped-for-privacy@earthlink.net (Bob=A0Davis)
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Well, I sat down and thought why can't I get the suction from my DC to my planer hood. Awwww, lets see. The hose is 4" diameter, the planer hood supplied by Delta is 4" x 8". Now the lineal run of the hose is 12.56 cubic inches per inch in length og hose. The lineal run of the hood is 32 cubic inches per lineal inch of the hood. This means that it loses almost three times the suction going from one size to the other.
This can be complicated when there is a shop vac used, going from 7.853 to 32 cubic inches.
Now, if you redesigned the hood to be 2.5 x 3 cubic inches per lineal inch of the hood. You'd move the suction all along the dust hood from the shop vac hose. Would the dust move. I'd think so.
If you don't think it would move then maybe you can explain why it moves in my system when the dust ports were redesigned.
--

Re: buying a dust collector

Group: rec.woodworking Date: Fri, Dec 26, 2003, 10:10am (MST-1) From:
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Woody's formula happens to work only for 4" hose because the radius squared happens to be the same as the diameter at 4". Otherwise you are not calculating area of the hose at all, rather it's circumference (see below). Beyond that, there is a trade off between air speed measured in Feet per minute (increased by smaller hose, to a point) and volume measured on Cubic Feet per minute (increased by large hose and less restrictions). Limit either one too far and the whole setup won't work as well.
3.1416 x diameter is circumference. Area is 3.1416 x radius (squared).
4" = Circ 12.5664 area 12.5664 3" = Circ 9.4248 area 7.0686 2.5" = Circ 7.854 area 4.90625
Excellent info found at
http://cnets.net/~eclectic/woodworking/cyclone/Ducting.cfm#Ducting%20Introduction
That said, this was not intended to be a shot at Woody, or anyone else.
Bob by Chicago
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What's the HP? I've got a 1.5 HP and now wish I had a 2HP, although with no more noise. Mine picks up well, except when a chunk of wood gets clogged in a bend (and don't realize it). Clear tubing is nice, though much more $. I have a cyclone garbage can (that I designed) that catches 90% of the dust before it reaches the DC.
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wrote:

have
(eyes,
It is 1.5HP. There is plenty of power, but the miter saw and table saw are both so wide open then I don't get any real grip on the dust. The router is all enclosed, so it is more than adequate. I don't think a 2hp would be much better; the trick is to figure out how to enclose them better. Or so it seems to me; maybe I am missing something.
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I've got a cabinet saw and it collects the dust well. I made foam inserts on the tilt that help pull more dust at the blade location. My miter saw doesn't have DC collection, but I've seen pyramid-shaped scoops made from thin hardboard that will catch some. I do less crosscutting than ripping, so I don't see the mitersaw station that much of a problem. If I had a lot of crosscutting work, I'd clamp a flex hose near the backend of the blade, where most dust is made.
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Check out http://wood.bigelowsite.com/index.htm There is a diagram for a pice that fits over the back of a Jet contractor's saw. I am going to try it out as soon as the Christmas holidays are through and I can get back to my shop.
Dick Durbin Tallahassee
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I have the JET 708639/DC-1100A 1-1/2HP Dust Collector. Bought it on Amazon. (why wouldn't you trust the reviews any more or less than here?). I bought 1 micron bags, I believe from Penn State Industries. I removed the 4" tee so I have a 6" input. Works great, as I'm just a 1 man shop. Much quieter than my shop vac, and really picks up those planer chips. I built a separator, but I need to look at some other plans, as mine separates only the biggest pieces.
The only quibble, and this isn't a model specific quibble, is disposing of the dust. It fills up 3 30-gallon bags easily!
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I should note also that I converted it to 220v.
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Loves Wood said:

I have an older Delta DC - built in Taiwan. It has been reliable, works fine, and is fairly quiet. I build a pre-collector that sits on the DC base and rolls around with it. It usually gets rolled outside when I'm making dust - so that I don't have to breath the fine stuff that makes it's way through the bag. I have a blast gate mounted in the door for easy hookup. I'm not worried about make-up air. The clean-up I have to do is markedly less and the sawdust makes a good mulch for acid loving plants. Just don't mix it IN the soil 'cause the breakdown process can deplete the soil of nitrogen needed by the plants. Blueberries love it. Also makes a fine fire starter for the fireplace.
The cheap unit (AP300?) they sell now is pretty crappy, the AP400 is as low as I would go.
I know someone with a Shop Fox 1 1/2 HP model - it seems like a good deal. FWIW
Greg G.
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I have a jet DC1200 with cartridge filter. I elected to go this route rather than the much more expensive cyclone. Its put together very well. I opted for 2 hp as a safety factor, knowing it would probably be overkill. Its always better to have a little too much instead of coming up short in this area, as far as I am concerned. Of course, I already had 220volt which made decision much easier. I didn't see any comparison between Jet and Delta, because of the cannister filter option.
As an experiment, I initially hooked it up with 6" metal flex hose to a homemade 6" duct on my table saw, then compared it to a 4" connection. Holy Cow what a difference that made. With the 6" hose, it allowed the blower to move into its optimum operating region and it was a virtual hurricane. It also brought out dust leaks all over the place.
By the way, my expectations were set correctly by reading a lot before making this purchase. Unless your tools are set up correctly for dust collection, any brand/size collector is not going to do much. I bought the collector, fully expecting to have to enhance/modify the dust collection on any tool I connected. I'm in the process of attacking the blade guard collection on my Jet table saw.
Bob

you
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I second the opinion on the Jet 1200 cartridge. It sucks great. It is quiet enough. I don't see any dust escaping. No cloth bags to beat causing dust to fly everywhere. And it's easy to empty. With a Lee Valley garbage can cyclone, it's even easier to get the dust out to the curb. -- Chris Corbett snipped-for-privacy@aol.com
San Antonio, TX
Remove the nospam from the email address.

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