Hi all,
Do modern WC systerns still need an external overflow pipe? I've been wonde= ring for years why they don't just overflow down into the soil exit pipe an= d save boring extra holes through outside walls and whatnot. Now I have a G= eberit wall frame unit to install and can't find any mention of overflow in= the instructions, so I'm guessing maybe it doesn't need one due to this. C= an anyone clarify the situation? I admit to being very out of date on this = subject!
Thanks.
Do modern WC systerns still need an external overflow pipe? I've been wondering for years why they don't just overflow down into the soil exit pipe and save boring extra holes through outside walls and whatnot. Now I have a Geberit wall frame unit to install and can't find any mention of overflow in the instructions, so I'm guessing maybe it doesn't need one due to this. Can anyone clarify the situation? I admit to being very out of date on this subject!
Thanks.
...
The only problem with that, is that you mightn't necessarily be aware there was any problem with the cistern unless it made a lot of noise in overflowing. Which it might not do if forming a steady stream. So it's possibly not a good idea certainly if your water consumption is metered.
External overflows have the advantage of being fairly obvious - as indicating a problem - to anyone standing outside.
michael adams
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wondering for years why they don't just overflow down into the soil exit pipe and save boring extra holes through outside walls and whatnot. Now I have a Geberit wall frame unit to install and can't find any mention of overflow in the instructions, so I'm guessing maybe it doesn't need one due to this. Can anyone clarify the situation? I admit to being very out of date on this subject!
The Water Supply (Water Fittings) Regulations 1999 require them to be fitted with a warning pipe or with a no less effective device. In other words, if you don't have a pipe that discharges an overflow in a visible place, you need an effective overflow alarm. Warning pipes are usually cheaper. However, they do not need to discharge externally, so long as the discharge is visible. Pipes are often lead into the back of the pan where an external pipe would either be difficult to instal or be unlikely to be noticed. Another method is to fit a tundish into the pipe near the cistern, although you would need to fit a U-bend after the tundish if you wanted to run it into the soil stack, to stop smells.
Colin Bignell
wondering for years why they don't just overflow down into the soil exit pipe and save boring extra holes through outside walls and whatnot. Now I have a Geberit wall frame unit to install and can't find any mention of overflow in the instructions, so I'm guessing maybe it doesn't need one due to this. Can anyone clarify the situation? I admit to being very out of date on this subject!
ISTR that there were regs about the visibility of overflows so problems were not overlooked. It now seems that overflows that run down the pan are accepted as being visible. Neither of our WCs (one Topravit and one labelled Utopia) have external oveflows.
There may well be regulations, but they are largely ignored. IME all new cisterns have internal overflows and I've never seen one with any kind of visible or other warning.
If they overflow, the customer usually describes it as "the toilet won't stop flushing". It's often the water bill that alerts you to the problem.
wondering for years why they don't just overflow down into the soil exit pipe and save boring extra holes through outside walls and whatnot. Now I have a Geberit wall frame unit to install and can't find any mention of overflow in the instructions, so I'm guessing maybe it doesn't need one due to this. Can anyone clarify the situation? I admit to being very out of date on this subject!
My cistern overflows internally and down into the pan. A few weeks ago there was a small leak around the outlet seal (or so I thought) and the only indicators were: occasional burst of filling (could be a faulty inlet - it's a bit fancy) dilution at the bottom of the pan then, leaving the pan to dry for a couple of hours after flushing, the back of the pan was still wet (the tissue test).
Replaced outlet seal - no go. Removed cistern and rebuilt the whole lot with new doughnut and sealant - leak was worse! Tightened the assembly just by turning it by hand (The bottom nut on the outside is very large and not very thick, so tools don't work too well) and the leak stopped.
The point is, such a leak isn't visible and, in this case, might have been
10 - 20 li/week, so only just enough to notice and almost within expected reading. Only the infrequent sound of the inlet was an obvious clue.Better than a mate's warning pipes from the 2 cisterns in the loft: went out to the gutter, then downpipe into ground, so no gully!
The requirement for a WC is for a warning pipe or an equally effective device. Internal overflows that flush down the pan are classed as an equally effective device.
Colin Bignell
PeterC wrote in news:1w32f0l0jl7id.1pjd7ubia2ryo$. snipped-for-privacy@40tude.net:
A couple of houses I drive past have elaborate hose-pipe connections to the external "Warning Pipe" to divert the water into a hopper. I guess the home owners feel really smug about their solution to the problem of water running out of a pipe! They have been like this for years. I guess all for the sake of a washer costing a few pence. Strange how some people fail to attack the cause of a problem.
On Tue, 04 Dec 2012 05:54:25 +0000 Hugh - in either England or Spain wrote :
Now that an increasing number of people have water meters, the water companies presumably care less and less.
Thames Water seem to have gone off the boil a bit with meters. Probably involves them in too much pipework
I'm surprised they have not built a microprocessor into them by now, can't be long.
Brian
A Raspberry Pee?
Only if you are on a meter though. Luckily, my old one still has an outside overflow, even though the cistern is plastic.
Brian
Ha! Or wire up an Ardu-wee-no.
The Japanese have.
The Bill Gates Foundation is looking at waterless loos (very useful in some third world countries), which convert everything that goes into them into plasma, which is then used to power the device.
Colin Bignell
Those things can be a bloody nightmare for rental properties in particular... your typical tenant on a water meter won't give monkeys about the fact that water starts running into the toilet bowl 24/7, and/or won't put two and two together and come up with the simple truth that they are wasting and having to pay for gallons of extra water per day. Then months later, the massive water bill comes in, and they expect the landlord to stump up the difference because it's down to fault in the property, as they see it. (Not BTDTGTTS, as it happens!)
David
Where upon Landlord points to clauses in rental agrreement requiring that faults are notified within a set period of time and also to an Appendix forming part of the agreement that has a non-exclusive(*) list of possible faults. An entry on which is a description of how to spot a failed ball valve in the loo cistern.
(*) Is that the right term? A list that doesn't include everything and something not being on the list doesn't exclude it from being considered on it.
"non-exhaustive" perhaps?
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