Harvested water for flushing

[Steve Firth]

It doesn't sound like a good solution to me. We collect rainwater via a sediment trap and a particulate filter into a large (3,000 litre) underground storage tank. Because of the difference in levels (~600 ft) we don't pump water into the tank from the watercourse in the valley below, but we do have an extraction licence (or the equivalent) and we also are about to construct a borehole for water extraction. These water sources could be pumped to the tank if necessary, probably using solar or windpowered pumps.

Since the system has to cope with lavatory flushing, instead of installing a changeover as you appear to be thinking of, we use the other approach of having a float valve in he tank. When levels get very low (below a reserve of 50 litres or so) the valve admits mains water so that there's always something there to flush the lavatory. Simple, effective and as close to automatic as you can get.

At present "grey" water is passed through a degreasing trap then to an anaerobic filter and then into land drains. Howewer I intend to get the quality of the effluent water checked and if the quality is sufficiently high that will be returned to the storage tank for slushing and irrigation.

Anyroad up you won't read this, so it's your loss.

[Owain]

Whyever not, if it's reasonably clean. Millions of people round the world, and quite a few in the UK, have untreated (or lightly treated) private water supplies and don't all have cryptospiridium or bilharzia.

You wouldn't survive long in the highlands then, where the beautifully soft mains water is brown thanks to the peat.

Owain

[Dave Plowman (News)]

Try reading what was written *carefully* And don't just read what you obviously want to into it. To me it says the job of making sure the harvested water on an automatic changeover system doesn't get into the mains might be 'fun' ie difficult.

[Andy Hall]

The wash cycle might be, but the last rinse cycles may be in cold water....

[Dave Plowman (News)]

I'll bet you don't have all the bits to do the fully automatic system I was thinking of...

You'll get pleasure from flushing your loo with rain water? What ever turns you on. However, I'd be inclined to investigate the cost of pumping etc and the life of such things. There is no shortage of water in this country or likely to be - only the distribution to heavily populated areas needs sorting.

[Guy King]

The message from Andy Hall contains these words:

Final cycle on diswashers is very hot - it's the drying cycle.

[Andrew Gabriel]

The final rinse is very hot in most of the ones I've had or used (all except a small cheap one). It is used to heat the contents so they dry afterwards.

[Dave Liquorice]

Good point, however when we used a dishwasher you could hardly handle the stuff due to it being too hot straight after the cycle had completed. You had to open the door a bit and wait 10 mins or so...

[Dave Liquorice]

I doubt there are many untreated private supplies in the UK. TPTB insist on regular testing and installation of suitable plant if levels of bugs and/or minerals and/or pollutants exceed certain limits. In fact I wouldn't be at all surprised to find that a private supply, filtered and UV treated *far* cleaner than the average public mains supply.

But we are talking about completely untreated, apart from settlement, rainwater collected from the roof. Complete with washed down bird poop, atmospheric fall out and what ever eggs/spores happen to be on said birds feet or in their poo or just fall out of the air.

I've drunk from fast flowing mountain streams with no ill effects but I do explore a good 50yds upstream first to make sure there isn't a dead sheep first. B-) I wouldn't drink dircetly from a lowland stream or river though.

Or Birmingham, good 'ole welsh peat in that case.

[Andy Hall]

Depends on the dishwasher, depends on the setting....

Either way, could one be certain that the temperature is high enough to kill off bugs?

Considering the tiny amount of water that dishwashers use, it's not really worth the effort anyway.

[Dave Fawthrop]

|Dave Liquorice wrote: | |. Also automatic (if required) change |> over between mains and harvested water might be fun and you really do not |> want any back siphonage of harvested water into the mains... |>

|How bloody irresponsible an answer. | |It doesnt sound like 'fun' to me. I take very seriously any threat to |Public Water Supplies. Your local Water Inspector might have something |to say about the possibility of a criminal offence, which it could be.

It is however a simple matter to prevent back siphonage, so mentioning the problem in the same sentence as saying that water harvesting is possible is highly responsible.

[Dave Fawthrop]

|On 2006-09-10 14:26:56 +0100, "Bob Minchin" | said: | |>> |> |> A friend of mine is currently selfbuildng a house and has installed a |> collection tank under the patio with an access hole for cleaning etc. It is |> filled from the gutters and has a commercial controller to switch between |> mains and tank water. He plans to use it for loo flushing and the washing |> machine.This extra potential use for filtered rain water should |> significantly shorten the payback time. Not sure if he is using it for the |> dishwasher too but the cost of electical heating might make this less |> economic? |> |> Bob | |Not really because most dishwashers are now cold fill using small |amounts of water. | |However, I am not sure that it's a good idea to use untreated water for |washing dishes

If the washing water is over 72 deg C when used pathogenic bugs will be killed.

[Christian McArdle]

No need. Just have a standard level valve on the collection tank that only comes on when the tank is very empty.

Christian.

[Christian McArdle]

Yes. Birmingham water is pretty disgusting. I was glad to go back to Reading. I basically only drink water and beer, normally.

Christian.

[<me9]

60odd years ago my mother used harvested rain water for all clothes washing. It was clear, and above all soft, and was used because the tap water was incredibly hard. It was stored in an oak cask, previously used for brandy, it smelt lovely when it arrived. The sediment sank to the bottom, and the tap, mounted about 4 inches from the base dispensed clear soft water, without additional filtering. The sediment was cleaned out about once a year.

[<me9]

But the very last stage is a high temperature dry.

[<me9]

Most but not all

[Dave Fawthrop]

|On 10 Sep, | Dave Fawthrop wrote: | |> If the washing water is over 72 deg C when used | |Most but not all | |> pathogenic bugs will be killed.

Which *pathogenic* bacteria will survive 72 deg C?

[Steve Firth]

Reading steals our water, the bastards.

[Dave Liquorice]

Thinking about it it might not be peat in Brums water but rust from the cast iron pipes that bring from the Elan Valley. At least it is soft. St Albans water wasn't nice, hard and the lime scale would be some rather intresting shades and green and blue... Up here our water was hard when it came from an adit just up the hill, but very clean white scale. We've since been switched to a reservior supply from the top of Weardale, soft and clean. B-)