Friends have a Alpha 240 E Gas Boiler which hasn't been serviced for years and sometimes goes out.
Should they get it serviced, or replace it with what?
Manual is
Gotta be worth getting a service first surely?
Tom
In article , george [dicegeorge] writes
_servicing_ manual..
It appears to be a low tech up firing boiler which IMLE can suffer from burner (and subsequent airflow) clagging[1] with combustion products. In other words, yes, this boiler should benefit from a good scrubbing out. Note, I don't mean a BG combustion sensor 'service', I mean a good scrape out of the combustion chamber from a trusted local boiler service tradesman.
Alternatively, a competent person(tm) could, after reading the service manual, have the front off the casing and combustion chamber in 2mins and set to scraping the crusties off (and between the legs of) the burner with a blunt, non metalic tool opening up the airflow no end. This in addition to any other mfr imposed service instructions.
[1] leading the uninformed to look at the differential air switch as faulty
Not if its best to scrap it and put in a new one. I dont know anything about gas, got wood and electric here. [g]
Do you scrap your car instead of servicing it? Sounds like a very expensive way of life. I would suggest that your friends ask for advice from someone who has a clue.
Tim
A gas expert has charged us £30 to look at it, and said "Diverter or Printed Circuit Board faulty, not advisable to renew boiler without new radiators, therefore advise complete new central heating system, approx cost £3330 to £3600"
Is it worth getting somebody to service this old a system, how do I know if the radiators really need to be replaced?
[george]In message , "george [dicegeorge]" writes
A gas expert?
What are his qualifications, then ?
Sounds cheap for an expert
Ah - you mean a clueless numpty then
Shouldn't really be too difficult to check out the diverter valve, even if the pcb is way over his head
basically, you have a diaphragm which moves when a tap is turned on which operates a pair of microswitches on the end of a shaft attached to that membrane.
Problems are either the diaphragm ruptures or microswitch contacts deteriorate
PCB, well, thats my domain
bit of a leap there
He must be after an expensive holiday this year
getting someone else in who has a clue
It's possible some or all are undersized if designed for an older boiler and changing to a condensing type. They run at a lower water temperature, so need a larger surface area radiator.
In message , "Dave Plowman (News)" writes
But to want to change the whole CH system because the fitter is either not competent or is trying to rip him off is more the problem here
Even allowing for a fitter's time, the job shouldn't come to more than a couple of hundred quid
or ... around 5% of the price the "gas expert" quoted
FWIW I had the slightly simpler Alpha 240 P without the auto-ignition ("P" for "pilot light" I believe). It was a . It was the only domestic item I've ever had insurance for and I got my money's worth, and then some. The main circuit board went within 12 months and that rather set the scene for the rest of its life.
Worst of all was that the engineers never had a clue what was wrong with it so most faults were a case of "replace, see if that works, repeat..." The faults were also frustratingly intermittent so it went wrong when you wanted a shower or the weather was cold but rarely with the engineer in the house.
I've recently replaced it with a Glow-worm. Why Glow-worm? Well over time I quizzed all the engineers (whilst softening them up with tea and biscuits in the traditional manner) and they were all consistent - "Worcester Bosch aren't bad, Vaillant are best, Glow-worm are down-market rebadged Vaillant". Most also added "I've got a Glow-worm".
It's only a few months in but thus far very happy with the new boiler - time will tell. And no, they didn't replace the radiators etc.
Paul DS.
It is amazing that these service men only know of what they see. There are far better boilers around than W-B and Vaillant. They probably never come across them. Like a mechanic who has only ever worked for a Ford dealer all his working life. They tend to recommend only Fiords.
Paul DS
If a system is sludged up, of course de-sludge it, but if you really want to protect the boiler from say a dirty old cast iron rad system (it is difficult to fully clean them), insert a plate heat exchanger between the boiler and the rad circuit with full-bore isolating valves for removal and cleaning. Then the boiler's innards will "always" stay very clean being isolated, meaning the boiler will last and be relatively trouble free and also operating at full efficiency as the main heat exchanger will be have baked on magentite.
I have done this in a few old systems with very old iron rads. The cost of rad replacement was just too much not to mention the upheaval. The bathroom changing cowboy plumbers would never think of anything so obvious and would suggest replacing all the rads.
I wire up boilers for my mate, and he is changing from Glowworm. They are good boilers, and cheap, so he makes a good profit on them, however, there have been so many minor faults with them over the last year, and after fitting a combi 2 weeks ago, that came with a faulty PCB, he is ditching them.
Some faults - the Glowworm Climapro controllers dont work this year. Yes, thats right, once it turned to 2012, some features no longer worked. Ring up GW, and they wont tell you that, they just say they'll send an engineer. And he is candid enough to tell us what the fault is, and just reset the clock to 2010, and all is well. They said they'll be sending out an update when it is sorted - what,they are going to replace all of the controllers they have supplied? - I dont think so, they dont like mentioning it, so have no intention of informing people who have bought it. Their integrated wiring system cannot be set up as supplied. There are settings that are not included in the installation book, and without these settings being made, the boiler will not work. When queried about this, the response was "yes, we know about that" - so why not print off an A4 sheet informing the fitter? Their 'Tech support' is useless. The people on the phone can never help, and just say 'we'll book an engineer for you', leaving people with no heat/water for 2 days, when it is usually an really quick fix if we knew what was wrong.
2 weeks ago, boiler was on all the time when fitted, so we took out the timer link, and it was still on all the time. A call to them said yes, this has happened before, we'll send an engineer out.That was a faulty PCB supplied new. Condensate pump has 3 wires to it, the boiler has 2 terminals, so where does the 3rd go? We got wise by now, and rang the engineer direct, who told us to cut off the connection around 2 inch down, and we'd see - it was actually 2 wires with one divided into 2 at the connectors. Of course, this was not noted in any of the documents supplied. 2 boilers had the heat sensors wired in the wrong way round, so the boiler kept cutting out, as it was sensing the return temperature rather than the flow. This has cost us probably 3 days work each tracing/fixing these faults in the last 6 months, and made us look idiots in the eyes of the customers, so another make is being sourced now.Alan
Uh?
Look at Intergas or Atmos (rebadged Intergas with some extra bits). You never go back. Also, look at Avantaplus. Remeha own baxi/pot now.
For the real RR go for ATAG.
Changing all the rads for a couple of hundred? Labour only?
You implied there were better makes than the ones I offered, but didn't say what they are - so what are they?
Paul DS.
I have given some.
Your other posts just showed up on my reader - wonder where they've been until now... Never heard of them but off to look them up.
Thanks, Paul DS.
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