Rural Irrigation/Remote Faucets Methods ??

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I have a vacation property in the mountains, of about six acres, two acres of which are cleared and developed. I have areas away from the house area in which I need water access for watering plants, flowers, etc. Ideally, I would love to have about three faucets in areas that are up to about 400 feet away from the house.
I can purchase 500 to 600 feet of hoses, and with the use of "T's" add several branches (hoses) to allow me to water in several selected areas. But, if I use high quality hoses, this would be pretty expensive, and it all seems so "temporary."
I am wondering if it would be more economical to run a main line of about 500 feet, using some sort of plastic pipe (cannot remember the name of the current most common), and then run my hose branches from that ? (The main line would have to lay on the ground, through the woods). Whatever I use, I need to be able to drain the line during winters, but I suppose I could get fittings for this equipped with a drain screw or valve or something.
Any ideas of what I should look for, or use ? Any general ideas of how to accomplish what I am trying to do ?
thanks !!
James
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On 6/29/2011 7:30 PM, James Nipper wrote:

so I'm not sure how it would work above ground. Here's a link: http://www.aquascience.net/pipe/index.cfm?idU2
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RBM wrote:

You don't say where this water is coming from. Is it town water, well water, what?
If you are laying pipe then poly pipe is what you need, it will be the cheapest choice for such a distance. All the fittings you would ever want are available. It can be laid underground if the ground isn't too rocky. The quickest method is with a ripper/feeder on a tractor. This is a blade that cuts a slit trench that has a metal tube behind it, you feed the poly down the tube into the slit as the tractor moves at walking pace, then you tred the slit down and it's done.
OTOH it can also be laid along fences on top of the ground. If going to this much trouble don't do it in 12mm (1/2 inch pipe) but somewhere around 32mm (1 1/4 ") to 40mm (1 1/2 "). This solution depends on what is pumping the water and how much rise or fall there is along the length. The joints in polypipe are easily undone to allow draining by gravity, ground slope permitting.
A quite different solution: what about saving water adjacent to the area that you want to water? I am thinking of a tank collecting water from the roof of an outbuilding or a small dam/pond in a gully.
David
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wrote:

Why not? Hose length has no bearing on water volume, only diameter matters.
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Brooklyn1 wrote:

A warning to all, Brooklyn1 has a habit of making confident pronouncements that are wrong.
The friction and hence head loss depends on both the length and diameter (and the number of fittings and joins and the change in level). Particularly in a thin pipe a long run (say 500ft) will have greater head loss than a short one (say 50ft) using the same source. The difference is less noticeable on large diameter pipe.
If you want to do the sums yourself see here:
http://www.polypipe.com.au/images/PPI%20small%20farm%20design.pdf
David
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"Bob F" wrote:

You had better put down that sudz.. you don't know the difference between pressure and volume.
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On Jun 30, 9:12am, Brooklyn1 <Gravesend1> wrote:

Because friction in the pipe will reduce pressure by a bunch and watering relies on flow, which needs pressure. Again we a discussing this without the needed information. Rise? Drop? initial pressure?
Harry K
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On Fri, 1 Jul 2011 07:22:22 -0700 (PDT), Harry K

A "bunch"... is that universally recognized scientific nomenclature? Internal turbulence does not occur to any appreciable degree in typical hard pipe, especially not with smooth plastic irrigation tubing. Fire hose is coarsely woven cloth so is rough and does cause turbulence but still reduction in volume is negligible considering the very high pressure pumps used for fire fighting... were it presenting a water volume problem you could bet your bippee that fire fighters would use something else. I can't imagine anyone using fire hose to water their garden. However gals like fire fighters watering their gardens because of their big rough hoses with all their volume and high pressure... and especially how they fold up so neatly for storage in their drawers. LOL-LOL
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On Jul 1, 9:58am, Brooklyn1 <Gravesend1> wrote:

Stretch out 500 ft of hose under 60psi and see what you have at the end when the water is running.
Harry K
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On Fri, 1 Jul 2011 21:55:00 -0700 (PDT), Harry K

I've done that occasionally... just as much volume exits 100' 200', 300' 400' as 500' or more, so long as the hose is not kinked/flattened or otherwise constricted or run up hill whatever volume enters exits... I'm positive you've never actually done what you suggest, except tinkling with your tiny 2" fuse. What people don't realize is that their hose bib valve is what dictates volume.. if your hose bib is supplied by 1/2" copper using 5/8" hose won't supply any more volume than a 1/2" hose, except for the first couple seconds untill the little more volume in the larger hose is expelled, kinda like the first burst or pressure from a pressurized hose laying out in the hot sun... a very brief surge. And most folks do have 1/2" domestic water plumbing in their homes to each outlet... then the only benefits of using 5/8' garden hose is that its larger diameter and wall thickness is much less prone to kinking/collapsing and has a longer life than 1/2" hose. It's silly to buy 3/4" garden hose for the typical residence, it offers no benefit, it won't produce more volume and will be heavy/clumsy, and will quickly fill your hose reel, not to mention being more costly for nothing... 3/4" hose probably can't be coiled into a small enough diameter to fit the typical home owner's hose reel anyway... 3/4' hose is meant for commercial applications. One can increase pressure at the discharge by limiting exit diameter, by adjusting a nozzle, but that reduces volume... volume can't be increased past what is supplied from the source. There is only so much volume available from the typical residential water supply, that's why sprinker systems are installed with several zones... without separate zones if all the heads were run at once they'd dribble n' drip like your widdle impotent peepee. It's plain silliness installing a grid of piping over a six acre property and then supply it from a residential well, one would still need to walk about opening one valve at a time and stand there like a putz watering for however long before moving on to the next area. MUCH easier hauling water to the various plants... leave a bucket with a hole in it by each plant, and just refill from your hauled buckets as needed, less than 30 seconds per plant. Many large commercial nurserys use this system, wastes far, FAR less water... many sink a few 3' lenghts of 4" perforated poly pipe into the ground around each newly planted sapling, then periodically pass by hauling a water tank with watering wand in hand, don't even need to get down from the tractor to fill the irrigators.
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On Jul 2, 7:28am, Brooklyn1 <Gravesend1> wrote:

Try telling all that to any plumber or irrigation specialisst. Prepare for them to laugh in your face.
Harry K
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On 7/2/2011 9:28 AM, Brooklyn1 wrote:

Have you ever heard of frictional losses?
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Steve Barker
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On Jul 1, 12:58pm, Brooklyn1 <Gravesend1> wrote:

I hook up 50 ft of 5/8" garden hose to the sill cock at my house and measure the water that flows out over 1 minute. I do the same thing with 500 ft of the same hose. According to what you're claiming when I measure it over 1 minute, the same amount of water will flow. You have much experience here on planet Earth?
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On Sat, 2 Jul 2011 00:09:53 -0700 (PDT), " snipped-for-privacy@optonline.net"

You've never done that, you don't have anymore 5/8" hose than your one 50' length or you could actually try it... I have many 100' lengths of 5/8" hose and have actually done what you suggest... whatever volume goes in one end comes out the other end... or do you mean when your mommy pinches your widdle peepee while changing your nappy.
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On Jul 2, 10:50am, Brooklyn1 <Gravesend1> wrote:

Of course whatever volume goes in one end comes out the other. That has nothing to do with what you claimed, which is that the volume of water flowing through a pipe depends ONLY ON THE DIAMETER. The volume of water flowing through a pipe depends on the diameter, length, and pressure. The narrower the pipe the more resistance to flow if has. The longer the pipe the more resistance to flow it has. That's how the laws of physics apply here on planet Earth. So if you connect 50 ft of garden hose to your home which has a water pressure of 50lbs you're going to get MORE water coming out the other end than if you connect 250 ft of hose. And if you connect a long enough length of hose you will get zero flow because 50 lbs isn't enough pressure to overcome the total resistance. Capiche?
And for someone so obviously ignorant, I would not be taking cheap shots at others here.
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LOL.
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Didn't know you could even buy w5/8" polyi or pvc. That's mighty small hole to push water that far. There is a reason why plumbing tables increase pipe size for distance.
Harry K
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On Fri, 1 Jul 2011 21:56:51 -0700 (PDT), Harry K

Nope, plumbing tables increase pipe diameter by how many taps branch off... there is no benefit to increasing diameter for just point to point. You obviously don't own your own home.
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On Jul 2, 10:38am, Brooklyn1 <Gravesend1> wrote:

Tell that to oil companies. I guess they are just stupid to build the Alaskan pipeline, for example, which is 4 ft in diameter and runs point to point. They should have consulted you and done it with a pipe 2" in diameter.
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On 7/2/2011 10:38 AM, Brooklyn1 wrote:

Sounds like someone is an "expert" who doesn't understand both basic physics and standard practice that results from it..
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