OT: police refuse to do their job

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Greetings,
I often transport tools in the trunk of my car. Last night someone broke into my car and ripped out the back seat to get into the trunk. I went to the police and they said that they would NOT fingerprint. This means that they will do absolutely nothing. I have flat chrome handles that likely would have fingerprints. There is metal behind the back seat cushion that the thief likely braced against. What are my options here? When I went down to make a report (because they would not come to me) I didn't have proof of insurance with me (I wasn't told to bring it) and they wouldn't even make out a report without it. I am outraged.
Thank you for your time and energy, William Deans
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Will -
If it helps any, I've had houses violated, with clear prints, where the cops wouldn't take them.
In fact, I was the prime suspect for about 10 minutes in officer mcgreedys crime search.
I understand your outrage.
But you can't change it.
Tally up your losses, get the insurance payoff, and be more prepared next time.
Forget the cops. They have more important things like seat belts and slow rolling stops to focus on.
Your rage will fade, your distrust will grow.
Such is life.
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Greetings,
If I somehow took the fingerprints myself (graphite and scotch tape?) is there any way to match those prints up with a human being? Would the police run them for me if I paid them?
Thanks, William
PS: What are the laws on citizen's arrest?
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let it go bill
you are outraged
no path lays before you
it wont happen
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snipped-for-privacy@gmail.com says...

You'd likely screw up the prints to the point where the lifted prints would be useless anyway.

Possibly, but the chances of the match occurring are pretty low.

No.
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Andy Simms wrote:

Where do I go to learn how to properly lift prints? I do not believe lifting a most prints is beyond my ability with simple training.

How do I get someone else to match them? Perhaps I should keep prints from all of my tenants on file. I could at least rule out that it was one them as I feel they are the most likely suspects. Is there simple matching software online? It must be quite commonplace now with all the fingerprint (thumb) access devices.

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snipped-for-privacy@gmail.com says...

You get a job as a police officer and apply for forensics training.

What you believe has nothing to do with the reality of the situation.

You don't.

Good luck getting them. If I was one of your tenants, I certainly wouldn't give you my fingerprints.

You need to get over the fact that you're the victim of a theft, and move on with your life. Quit trying to play policeman and go back to your regular job.

No.
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Andy Simms wrote:

....
Oh, I'd think it is most likely <something> simple in the BioAPI stuff, but it won't be of use for this purpose...the problem is there's no generally-accessible database and OP doesn't have a suspect database, either.
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Duane Bozarth wrote:

Greetings,
The suspect database would be the tenants as they know about the tools in the trunk. This doesn't mean that a tenant did it -- but it would be a good place to start.
William
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" snipped-for-privacy@wdeans.com" wrote:

Excepting you don't have (and can't require) the data to populate the proposed database...
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Duane Bozarth wrote:

Greetings,
I can always start today requiring it for any new leases signed. Within a year I would have a complete database. Would it be a violation of privacy to acquire it during home inspection? If I change the locks and take the old doorknob home with me is it against the law to fingerprint it once I arrive at my house?
William
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" snipped-for-privacy@wdeans.com" wrote:

I don't know that you <can> require it, nor do I know that you can't ask, but I would suspect the likelihood of getting willing tenants will go down exponentially--I know I certainly would not do so just on general principles.
Other subtrefuges may or may not be legal but would probably not yield admissible evidence as you would probably have chain of custody issues even if you could manage to execute the process.
My question is why do you think it's likely a tenant is the culprit anyway? If so, would seem like you're not screening tenants very carefully to begin with. Of course, if you're renting in a low-rent district, that could very well just be an occupational hazard.
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Duane Bozarth wrote:

Many financial institutions ask for a thumb print on checks cashed. If they can ask I don't see why I cannot ask. I don't know if tenants will be unwilling to voluntarily give it when signing a lease but I'll give it a try and get back to you. I would provide it if someone asked me. I don't think it is out of line with providing a SSN which (most) everyone provides willingly.

Sue also brought up the chain of custody issue. If there are, for instance, multiple prints on the car apparent after dusting I only have to lift one of them. If someone wants to dispute the chain of custody an officer can come back and lift another print. I do not know if it is possible to lift the same print twice but it doesn't seem unreasonable.

I think it was someone who knew I transport tools in the trunk. Tenants are a large part of that crowd who would be interested in stealing them.
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You surely have the right to refuse the thumbprint.
What do you think the next sentence out of the teller's mouth will be?
An old joke goes something like this:
A constitutional legalist goes to cash his check.
Teller asks for fingerprint.
Man refuses and cites several Constitutional passes.
Teller calls manager.
Manager comes over and asks problem. Teller relates story.
Manager leans over and whispers, "Listen, you dumb cracker. Put your fingerprint on that check or I will rip your arm off and beat you with it."
Manager walks off.
Man hurriedly puts thumbprint on check.
Teller asks why he wouldn't do that for her.
He says, "You didn't explain it that clearly."
Steve
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" snipped-for-privacy@wdeans.com" wrote: ....

None I deal with have ever asked and they won't get if they do... "Can" and "Get" are two differing things...

Well, one thing comes to my mind is the question of what Fair Housing and other state/local jurisdictional laws/rules say...

I frankly don't care, but I think I can predict the response... :)

Well, you can do what you want...I don't give SSN out willingly, either.

Why are they any more interested than the run-of-the-mill crackhead off the street who just happened to be wandering by when you put them there?
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snipped-for-privacy@gmail.com says...

Good luck with that. I can't speak for anybody else, but if a landlord was to require my fingerprints in order to get a lease, I'd find another landlord.

Yes.
You'd have a very hard time getting usable prints from a doorknob. Because it gets turned, the prints are likely to be smeared and unusable.
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It surely would be tossed out of court.
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On 13 Aug 2005 06:35:20 -0700, " snipped-for-privacy@wdeans.com"

Don't bother. There is something called "chain of custody" for evidence that they don't emphasize on the crime shows. Evidence collected by you will be so dubious that it wouldn't hold up in court. It has nothing to do with your skills or personal integrity, so don't be offended :)

You won't get access to databases, if that's what you're thinking about.

No. Even law enforcement aren't allowed to run fingerprints for their own curiousity or for citizens.
Your best bet is to install a security camera, particularly if you think it was one of your tenants.
I know how frustrating it can be to deal with the police re: break-ins. Sometimes they are very good; other times they obviously resent being taken away from something more important like a donut break!
Sue(tm) Lead me not into temptation... I can find it myself!
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For those who missed it, this point was made again and again in the OJ trial, and evidence was tossed again and again.
Steve
STeve
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snipped-for-privacy@wdeans.com wrote:

Teach yourself. It's dirt simple. You need:
1. Very fine black powder. Copier toner works swell. 2. A small brush with long, fine bristles. 3. 2" wide, clear, packing tape. 4. 3x5" cards.
Put the toner on the suspect area. Brush (or blow) away the excess. Press the tape on the print, lift and put the tape containing the print on the card.
For chain of custody, write some facts on the card (date, your initials, location) before adding the tape and print.
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