Need help with Drain Plumbing Mystery

[Retired]

I am trying to help my daughter & SIL with a plumbing issue. The house was built in 1955 near Hartford CT. They have lived there for 8 years.

The 4" cast elbow going to the 1st floor toilet has corroded and is leaking, It appears to have been replaced in the past, using some kind of "lead" to seal a butt joint, and a "tap" for an iron pipe.

Pictures can seen at

All of the small sink & tub drains are copper, feeding into the cast. The iron pipes (there appear to be a total of 3) go vertically into the wall above. What are they there for ?? Vents ?? Only the 4" cast sticks thru the roof. We cannot see any piping above the basement as all walls are finished on 1st and 2nd floors.

Questions:

1. What was used to seal the butt joint and the "tap" on the "repair" ? Looks like some kind of brushed-on lead or solder that was heated/melted slightly to create seal.

1. Is the iron pipe "tapped" into the elbow necessary ??

We could probably repair this ourselves, using DWV & a Fernco coupling, if we did not need to re-do the tap.

If tap is required, what are possible ways to replace the elbow, with the iron pipe tapped in ??

Thanks, Old Dad

[Stormin Mormon]

That looks like a complete nightmare. I'd be tempted to wrap it in fiberglass and Bondo, and hope it holds till after the house is sold.

I'm not a plumber, and I sure am grateful! I expect the real plumbers are grateful I'm not out there, doing hack work.

Christopher A. Young Learn more about Jesus

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The 4" cast elbow going to the 1st floor toilet has corroded and is leaking, It appears to have been replaced in the past, using some kind of "lead" to seal a butt joint, and a "tap" for an iron pipe.

Pictures can seen at

All of the small sink & tub drains are copper, feeding into the cast. The iron pipes (there appear to be a total of 3) go vertically into the wall above. What are they there for ?? Vents ?? Only the 4" cast sticks thru the roof. We cannot see any piping above the basement as all walls are finished on 1st and 2nd floors.

Questions:

1. What was used to seal the butt joint and the "tap" on the "repair" ? Looks like some kind of brushed-on lead or solder that was heated/melted slightly to create seal.

1. Is the iron pipe "tapped" into the elbow necessary ??

We could probably repair this ourselves, using DWV & a Fernco coupling, if we did not need to re-do the tap.

If tap is required, what are possible ways to replace the elbow, with the iron pipe tapped in ??

Thanks, Old Dad

[Atila Iskander]

Consider getting rid of the whole cast iron elbow from the toilet bowl to the stack and replacing it with PVC Make sure that galvanized pipe is not being used as a venting stack. From the ceiling, I would go vertical + 90 elbow + horizontal with side pipe connector Join side pipe to iron pipe with rubber sleeve You can also cut the cast iron about 5" under ceiling and use a rubber sleeve there to connect to a short PVC vertical + elbow. But if the toilet is on the floor above, replacing everything from the toilet on down to the stack is the cleanest solution that should be good for a long time.

[trader4]

I would think they are drains going to other places, like sink, bathtub, shower, etc. One vent going up from there, which you say is there, is al the venting that is needed at that point.

Don;t know, but back in the day lead was poured in to seal the gaps where these cast iron fitting mated.

That would seem to depend on where it goes. If it's a sink drain, then it would be necessary. If it went somewhere that is no longer used due to remodeling, etc, then it's not necessary.

When you've got the old 4" waste section out, unscrew either just the short nipple or else the longer two foot long piece of 2" galvanized pipe. Get a threaded PVC male adaptor which will screw in to the remaining piece. Then you have to figure out if you have enough room and can find the appropiate fittings to tie it in to the new 4" PVC. That may be difficult or impossible because you don't have much room. It's hard to tell from just the photo.

The alternative would be to cut the other copper drain line that is below and on the right in the picutre and put a T into it using Ferncos or soldering in a copper T. Then route from the galvanized over to the new T using PVC.

[DanG]

What you see is typical old wiped lead. This is done with the lead in a molten state and wood paddles. It is a lost art. The last union apprentice class to learn it here was in 1955.

Replace all of the lead work with PVC. The side inlet looks like another drain line from something above. I would assume it to be live and functioning and as such will need to be joined into the new PVC or into the cast iron stack. It was probably joined to the lead as that was much more simple than joining the cast iron.

[hrhofmann]

Use Fernco and PVC piping as necessary. Not a big deal.