Muriatic Acid Before Tiling?

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My tiling book says to sand the concrete with a coarse grit sandpaper and then wash with muriatic acid. A friend of mine thinks muriatic acid is way overkill and just washing the floor would suffice. I'd rather avoid using the stuff. Any thoughts?
(BTW, concrete is interior slab...seems smooth. Troweled surface?)
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The purpose of the acid is not to clean the floor but to etch the surface for a better bond. I don't know if it's necessary for tiling but I can tell you it sure is for painting. When in doubt, follow the instructions and ventilate as much as possible.
Steve.
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SteveF wrote: <<purpose of the acid is not to clean the floor but to etch the surface for a better bond. I don't know if it's necessary for tiling but I can tell you it sure is for painting. When in doubt, follow the instructions and ventilate as much as possible.>>
Good advice, thank you.
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Don't forget to dilute the acid at least 5 to 1 with water. % parts water to 1 part acid and then rinse well.
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<<Don't forget to dilute the acid at least 5 to 1 with water. % parts water to 1 part acid and then rinse well. >>
I am concerned about thoroughly rinsing; it's not like a porch that I can hose off. This is in the middle of my house. I was thinking of mixing some baking soda in with the rinse water.
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The times I've done it I just put down some water and sucked it up with my shop vac. Repeat (and repeat and repeat) until all the areas have been rinsed a couple times. I've not used anything other than water.
Steve.
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<<<The times I've done it I just put down some water and sucked it up with my shop vac. Repeat (and repeat and repeat) until all the areas have been
rinsed a couple times. >>
Ah, good idea!
You know, the shop vac has got to be my favorite tool. ;-)
Thanks for the ideas!
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Here's another one - take out the filter first and make a splash guard to keep water out of the motor so you don't soak the filter as they cost about half the cost of the vac.
Steve.
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<<don't soak the filter as they cost about half the cost of the vac. >>
I have an old one that is covered with joint compound that I could use. I was going to try to clean it, but this might be a better use of that resource.
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The pleated filters are expensive, but the paper filters are much cheaper. For Shop-Vac brand walmart has a bag of 3 with no plastic ring, if you have the ring. Other stores, like Lowes, sell the filters with a plastic ring, for a little more, which** you need to hold the filter to the cage. Although I agree that perhaps the side of the cage near the input hole could be covered to keep the muritic acid out of the motor. You have to leave the other side open or it won't suck.
**HD sells another brand that might not be the same size, I forget, but it uses a big rubber band iirc. The rubber band is smaller when not using it, but rubber bands can wear out or dry out and I already have the plastic ring.

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Greg Esres writes:

What's the issue with rinsing? Concrete is very alkaline and will neutralize any HCl residue if you scrub it in and then sponge it up.
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<<What's the issue with rinsing? Concrete is very alkaline and will neutralize any HCl residue if you scrub it in and then sponge it up. >>
I'm not sure exactly....the directions are a bit vague about the penalties for not rinsing. Perhaps it is remnants of the chemical reaction that need to be cleaned out, rather than the chemical itself. I do have this mental images of it eating through my foundation, though. ;-)
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Greg Esres writes:

As I said, sponge it up well. Or puddle some rinse water and squeegee it off. Or use a wet extraction carpet cleaner.
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the acid wash leaves a chalky residue when it dries if your painting over concrete you need to remove this residue so the paint will bond to the concrete. (I am assuming your going to paint)
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Ha I guess I should have paid attention to the subject.
as Rosanna Rosannadanna says " Nevermind"
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<<Ha I guess I should have paid attention to the subject. >>
I was wondering if I was supposed to paint before applying the thinset... ;-)
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Seems as if it ought to leave salt. (Calcium chloride?)

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I'd try to find an alternative.
Muriatic is (or turns to) Sulfuric (or is it Hydorchloric?) acid. For a small job, it might be manageable. For major square footage, it can get out of hand. Truly Nasty Stuff.
If you gotta do it, take muy mucho serious precautions. The fumes are toxic. You could get a surface coat of rust on any iron-based materials in the area.
And, yeah, after it's done it's work, baking soda or any lye compound will help neutralize the acidity.
Good Luck, Puddin'
"Life is nothing but a competition to be the criminal rather than the victim." - Bertrand Russell
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Muriatic acid is usually about 32% hydrochloric acid, and the rest water. Hydrochloric acid is essence of vomit.
It's a real acid. *I* wouldn't have called it "truly nasty", but you do want to treat it with respect.
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<<If you gotta do it, take muy mucho serious precautions>>
Wilco, thank you.
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