I want outlets like this.

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On 1/24/2011 2:38 PM, N8N wrote:

This is the first time I've ever heard such nonsense. WTF would it possibly matter? LMAO!!
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Steve Barker
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com...
If at your age it has to be explained to you, no - it won't matter to you. There is no functional difference. Just as painting all of the walls of your house the same color is more 'functional' than all of those fussy different colors. It's an aesthetic thing. A professional that doesn't worry about aesthetics is not a professional.
Ever see a panelboard that looks like spaghetti? Still works just fine, right? No functional difference. But a professional cares how it looks and, at least in the case of the panelboard, tries to make it easier for the next guy.
R
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On 1/24/2011 5:24 PM, RicodJour wrote:

Dressing the wires in a service panel well does serve a function- makes it easier to trace and diagnose circuits. As does labeling circuits. Not just for power panels, comm panels also benefit greatly from good cable dressing. Aligning the slots in the screws is OCD.
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aem sends...

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Since you're quibbling, I'll quibble, too. What you describe is not a functional difference, but a difference in ease of maintenance. Tracing and labeling circuits don't make the electrons flow more easily or lower the electrical bill. They are not functional differences. The issue of maintenance is the point I mentioned earlier - professionals make it easier for the next guy and pay attention to all aspects of their work, not just "git her done." And by professionals I don't mean people that simply earn their income in a certain area.

And? What's your point? OCD is a stupid designation made by stupid people to conveniently place other people in categories that the stupid people made up for their convenience, most likely so the stupid people could put the designated people in those stupid categories and check off the stupid ICD-9 list so the stupid insurance industry could disallow coverage more easily.
Do you think for one minute that the standout kids of your high school class wouldn't be classified as OCD? Hey, the kid never stops dribbling that basketball - OCD. That kid's got his nose stuck in a book 24/7 - OCD. What is with her and that baton?! OCD. Sure, there are extremes of anything, and OCD is no different. At the extremes where people can't function it's obviously a problem, but whether you want to acknowledge it or not, most of the stuff you admire and lust after were creations of people who no doubt would be classified by those stupid people as OCD.
If a restaurant has a sloppy kitchen that does not automatically mean that the food is bad, but it's probably a damn good indication. An immaculate kitchen is no guarantee of great food, but you're far more likely to get good food out of a restaurant where it is. And less likely to pick up some bug.
Did you ever try to get someone interested in something where they had no interest? Kinda tough, idn't it? Did you ever try to make someone _lose_ interest in something they were interested in? That's impossible. People are designed that way. It's what keeps people working late at night, makes them wake up fired up and raring to go, and it's what makes work play for some people.
Would you rather hire someone who took care with all aspects of working on _your_ building, no matter how small, or would you rather hire the guy who only worried about what the last coat of paint looked like?
That is obviously a rhetorical question as you wouldn't be dicking around answering questions to help people do the right thing in their homes if you only cared about "git her done."
There is only one thing in this world that has any truth to it - quality. And it's sad that you feel a need to disparage that which you apparently do not understand simply because you don't see a 'need'. You see, the OCD professionals have a word for people that don't take pride in all aspects of their work - a hack.
Those aligned screws? Where else is an electrician's work on display for everybody to see? It's all hidden behind the walls and behind a panel board cover. Those screws are the only things that your average person sees that the electrician has done, and as far as I'm concerned their not paying attention to the visible stuff doesn't bode well for their unseen stuff.
R
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On 1/24/2011 8:24 PM, aemeijers wrote:

AMEN.
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Steve Barker
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s.com...
Agreed, OCD at the very least...
You might worry about such people who MUST align their electrical cover plate screws going postal in the workplace one day... :O
~~ Evan
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On Mon, 24 Jan 2011 14:24:57 -0800 (PST), RicodJour

>>>>>>
When I put those screws in my concern is getting them to the right tightness to properly snug down the plate and make everything in the right plane. Making all the slots line up would sometimes defeat getting things in the right plane so the face of the outlets/switches are just flush with the cover plate. I'm much more concerned with the cover being flush then with the screw slots being aligned. And I think users would be more likely to notice non-flush covers then unaligned screw slots. If you can do both, that's even better.
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I'd say you need to get out more. It is a common practice among journeymen electricians, and it shows that what is behind the cover plate will be right, too. It's a signature thing, not practiced or understood by sloppy workmen.
Steve
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You know, I can see both sides of this discussion. (We haven't started arguing yet, but trust me, it's coming!)
Vertical screws *could* mean "pride in their work" and "that what is behind the cover plate will be right, too" or it could mean a couple of other things:
1 - "I'll put lipstick on this pig and they'll think I did a quality job."
2 - "I *think* I know all about wiring, but I really don't know a damn thing about it. The one thing I do I know is that the pros set their screws vertically, so I'm going to do that too. I, therefore, must be a pro."
Bottom line: vertical screws may not mean anything at all...then again, they might.
You really don't know unless you pull a few covers and see what's behind the curtain.
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On 01/24/2011 04:58 PM, Steve Barker wrote:

it doesn't, but like I said, it's a sign. Shows pride in your work.
nate
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Nate Nagel wrote:
[snip]

It shows you're doing things other than a good job.
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Mark Lloyd
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I am an expert welder. I can look at another welder's work, and tell from looking if it is good or not. There are certain things to look for, just as in all crafts, but those things go right over the head of a layman.
Steve
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On 1/24/2011 11:03 PM, Steve B wrote:

I too am a professional welder , son and father of boilermakers. I can most completely assure you, you CAN NOT judge a weld by appearance. If you could, then we could save millions of dollars by not having to x-ray welds. And I can also assure you that lining up screws on a damn electrical plate is the most ridiculous waste of time I've ever heard of, and it means nothing.
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wrote

Well, Steve, you said it, so it must be so.
You the man, Steve..............
Steve
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On 1/25/2011 12:29 AM, Steve B wrote:

thanks!
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Steve Barker
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You seem to be reading selectively. Please go back and reread the thread and see if you can find the part where you made the assumption that someone said that neatness was a GUARANTEE of quality. Actually, I'll save you the time - nobody said that. What was said by more than a few people is that neatness counts. Where's your beef with that?
Do you shower and shave every day, or are you a scruffy guy? If you're a scruffy guy, and it's a Friday night and the missus wants to go out, do you shave and shower or insist on being scruffy? If you're the type that insists on being scruffy, well, there's no point in carrying this conversation any further, is there? If not, ask your missus whether she likes you cleaned up or scruffy.
See, there's the other point. When you do work not everybody notices everything, but somebody will notice. Many times it's the wife who has a sharper eye than the husband. But you know who I get the most compliments from about my work? Other contractors. Many times it's the homeowner telling me what a contractor said to them about my work. The guy will come into their house for whatever reason - friend, relative, doing work, whatever - and they'll say, "That guy does nice work." Perhaps you don't care, but I kind of get the warm fuzzies when I hear that. But I don't do the little things for other people - I do them for me.
When you see a welded aluminum frame and the welds are all neat little stacks of nickels running around curved tubes, what do you think? Do you think that the guy was a newbie and doesn't care about his work, or do you think, nice welds, looks good, guy knew what he was doing? More to the point - what do your welds look like? Post some pictures I want to see them. Seriously. If they look like shit I'll figure that you simply don't care about such things. If they're nice clean welds (which is probably a safe assumption as you're obviously proud of being in a family of welders), then it's simply a matter of you not realizing that there are some people that are concerned about how ALL of their work looks. Even the trivial stuff.

No, Usenet is the most ridiculous waste of time. We all know that, it just happens to be fun.
R
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And it's pretty hard to not point out that pride in your work requires anal-retentivity training.
R
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On 1/24/2011 2:38 PM, N8N wrote:

When I install networks, sometimes the plate screws are Phillips head. It screws with some people's minds. (pun intended) :-)
TDD
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wrote:

com...
LOL... Just phillips head ?
I have seen some more secure tamper proof screws used in places where even more safety and security for the electrical connections is required...
~~ Evan
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On 1/25/2011 12:38 AM, Evan wrote:

I installed some credit card readers for a big retail chain and all the screws had tamper proof heads. They were not just tamper proof torx, the screws were a proprietary pattern. None of my tamper proof torx heads fit them because the splines were at different odd angles.
TDD
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