Energy Kinetics System 2000 oil boiler... Anyone have one? (2023 Update)

[ellhc]

I'm in the process of getting quotes for a new boiler to replace a 25 year old Burnham. The new boiler will have an indirect hot water tank (presently a heating coil in the boiler). I've gotten several quotes and it looks like there's a ~$1500-$2000 premium to be paid for the Energy Kinetics System 2000 or the Buderus unit.

The Bedurus so far as I can tell is just an extremely well built conventional boiler with a great control unit.

I am leaning towards the System 2000.

- well engineered

- great control unit that's much less expensive than the $700 Buderus Log control

- efficiency

- sealed combustion

- outside air for combustion

- US built (all things being equal, I always buy made in USA)

So far, the independent heating/plumbing contractors love this boiler while the oil companies (who also quoted on this job) hate them... The oil companies claim that the system 2000 is

- infefficient

- needs to be cleaned/maintained more often (given the construction, I can't believe this)

- bad repair history

- parts hard to obtain

- steel boilers are unreliable

Now the plumbers tell me confidently that I will see a 30% or more savings on oil usage. If true, I can't blame the oil guys for talking me out of the System 2000. But it is a unique boiler and I do have concerns about the reliability. Particularly with the steel boiler.

So does anyone have a System 2000 in their house? Happy with it? Is the $2000 premium worth it? Thanks!

[m Ransley]

Get efficiency ratings from the manufacturers

then go to "the wall" it is a friendly group not like althvac haks

[DOUGLAS]

Steel boilers can last as long as cast iron as long as air is purged and kept out of the system. It's the free oxygen in the air bubbles that aids in corrosion.

I've seen many steel boilers (there are quite a few Columbia steel oil fired boilers in my area) that have lasted 30 to 40 years. Like most things, maintenance is a factor in achieving good longevity.

Aside from the above comment, I have no knowledge of the efficiency of th System 2000 except to say that it has to be more efficient than your old boiler. Newer USA government regulations, as of 1991, I believe, require a minimum efficiency of 80% (78% with standing pilot) for residential oil and gas fired heating systems. Your old Burnham is probably 70% at best. The manufactoorer must list the seasonal AFUE. What figures does System 2000 give for their unit?

Doug

[ellhc]

System 2000 AFUE is ~86% but they make the claim that this is a poor measure of real efficiency. Check them out...

I'm not a thermal or HVAC engineer but technically what they claim makes sense. I'm just about sold but need to know how reliable they are before paying the significant premium.

Oh and thanks to m Ransley for pointing me to

I've already found a wealth of information. My conclusion thus far is that the Energy Kinetics System 2000 does operate as advertized provided that it is installed and adjusted and maintained properly and there's no problems with the rwliability. However, they are more difficult to install, adjust and maintain...

[dhmeiser1]

I have had one in my house for about 12 years. No major problems.

Some things to keep in mind though.

The internal boards will fry if lightning strikes near your house have good surge suppression on you house.

Have the installer give you the emergency board so the system will operate as a normal boiler if the board goes bad.

Have the system cleaned regularly

Are you going to use a chimney or use the power vent kit? If you use the power vent kit make certain that the power vent is in a location where it does not trap heat. Had to replace the blower once due to this.

The zone valves sometimes stick in the open position, ask your installer to add the proper lubricant additive to the boiler water.

Funny thing is that our oil supplier was the one who recommended the system, now they don't sell this as it does save oil use. We went from

2000 gal to about 1800 gal of oil used per year for our house. This includes domestic hot water as well.

[ellhc]

Hmmm... maybe I'll wire in an isolation transformer.

once a year wheather it needs it or not...

Chimney.. no problems here...

They don't use standard Honeywell zone valves?

My oil supplier is absolutely adament that this boiler is tough to adjust and not reliable. But your savings of 10% is far less than the

30% claim that Energy Kinetics is making. Did your old boiler make hot water as well?

[EL]

For what it's worth...

I can't comment specifically on the boilers you're looking at. But that claim of "30% savings" seems awfully suspicious.

An old boiler (and by "old" I mean 40+ years) might be 70% efficient. Even with a boiler of this age, to obtain a 30% reduction in oil usage the new one would have to be 100% efficient which is impossible except in the case of a heat pump.

I suspect more realistic numbers might be 75% for the old one and 95% for the new one, giving a 20% savings. That's *if* the new one is 95% efficient - that's an awfully high number.

Eric Law

[m Ransley]

If you look at Energy Kinetics comparisons of gas to oil operating cost savings their numbers are even more unbeliveable. For one gas furnaces go to 94.5 % vs 87% for energy kinetics . Im sure it is a good unit , but run your own numbers first.

[dhmeiser1]

They don't use standard Honeywell zone valves? They are not the thermal zone valves but moterized and somtimes the return spring will stick.

Can't say about the savings as our house is about 100 years old and the old boiler was just about as old. previous owners gave us the oil bills from the year they moved out. Before replacement we had an electric water heater after new system the EK provied hot water.

As for adjustment and relilablity never had a problem, sounds like he doesn't want to send his crew to the traiining EK provides.

[Satisfied Customer]

We built a house in 2001 and installed a System 2000. Couldn't be more satisfied with it. During the first couple years a fuel jet had to be replaced and that is the only repair we've had to do. Runs quiet, burns more efficiently and you get plenty of hot water. The only down side is that we put in a power vent instead of venting into a chimney. The fan needs to be cleaned at least once a year - it's starts getting very loud and vibrates when dirty. If you can vent into a chimney I bet you'd never know it is running.

[Ed Pawlowski]

I've posted here before about mine. My oil savings run 38% to 40% over my old 1978 model boiler it replaced. I've been tracking by degree days for comparisons year t years. Going on 4 years now. Not a problem.

[Bailey]

we had the system 2000 installed in september of 2022 and immediate we smelled a hydrogen sulfide odor in the hot water. the company that installed it will "flush" out the hot water tank at no cost to us (under warranty) but we would have to get the well "shocked" before they do the flushing. we've been in the house for 14 years with a peerless boiler and have never had this smell. I'm, wondering if anyone else has had this problem.

[Ed Pawlowski]

Don't have a well but never had it with city water. I has the System

2000 for about 10 years and it was excellent. I tracked oil use and over my old system I was saving about 38%.

[Wynter126]

Have had a new system 2000 since 2006, installed by a local heating oil company. It would behoove you to keep that same oil company as your delivery service. I switched to a different company with a service contract ..( for 10 yrs.) Over that time period not all company repairmen know how to fix my furnace. I called with a ..no heat ..problem. Took them 3 days and $1100. of labor and parts shipped up from NJ. None of which should have occurred but they ( all 4 repairmen ) had different ideas of what to fix. They changed the copper piping around so I'm not sure if it will function as originally installed.....Lucky the winter weather was mild. Thankyou...

[Ed P]

Had one in my last house. Saved me about 38% on oil use each year tracked by degree days. Never had a service issue.