Did they change treated lumber AGAIN?

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I can't give that to you. My information came from a recommendation from a pediatrician who mentioned the subject because HE had seen data indicating arsenic in kids who'd spent time in contact with playground structures built with treated lumber. This conversation took place 1994-1995. This is all the information I can give you right now.
Now, we're going to talk in circles because I'm going to ask you again what would be required in order to show health problems as a result of exposure.
Ready?
What would need to happen?
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This is getting really silly. You're not talking about the same thing.
There is no arsenic in ACQ. ACQ wasn't around (much) in 1994/95.
There is arsenic in CCA. CCA is the treatment that has been "discouraged", and what your pediatrician was talking about.
Now, figure out between yourselves which one you were really talking about ;-)
--
Chris Lewis,

Age and Treachery will Triumph over Youth and Skill
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I'm referring to the older version, and waiting for him to catch up. He keeps asking about ACQ. You'd think the word "arsenic" would cause him to step backward through the messages and see what's what.
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Chris Lewis wrote:

Yeah, I inadvertently used the ACQ initial when I meant CCA earlier. Same difference to Joe, though... :)
--
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No. We're talking about arsenic. The initials weren't important.
Again: We are talking only about arsenic.
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JoeSpareBedroom wrote:

A report from a pathologist citing Arsenic posioning from treated lumber as the cause of death.
Any recollection from a pediatrician is garbage. They are more "socially aware" than librarians in promulgating absurd and agenda-driven (i.e., no scientific basis) ideas.
For example: http://www.aap.org/family/tipp-firearms.htm
And http://pediatrics.aappublications.org/cgi/content/full/116/3/e370
In medicine, pediatricians are toward the bottom of the pecking order: below tattoo-removal dermatologists and only slightly higher than chiropractors.
Take NOTHING a pediatrician says at face value. Reliance on same as authorative has as much credence as crop-circle conjecture.
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The question was not directed at you, Clevis. But, as long as you've been activated, tell me about some of the honorable professions in YOUR family. You, your wife, kids, grandkids, etc.
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JoeSpareBedroom wrote:

That's what epidemiologists do for a living. They're prolific on lead, etc., but for CCA common as hen's teeth.
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You're insisting you're correct. I might agree with you. But first, I need an answer to the question that frightens you, apparently.
Here's the question again:
In order to show that health problems were caused by arsenic exposure, WHAT WOULD NEED TO HAPPEN?
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Gee - How about evidence that there's a problem?
Not hypothetical's. Not emotional responses that arsenic is dangerous thus all uses of it must be banned. Not anecdotal stores about a friends neighbors cousin saw a kid on the deck next door licking the railing.
Hard evidence that a significant number of kids are dying or even affected by long term illness when arsenic is used as a wood treatment on outdoor decking.
-- "Tell me what I should do, Annie." "Stay. Here. Forever." - Life On Mars
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wrote:

Bingo. Now, one of you geniuses can explain why it would be unlikely that kids in a country like this would reach the stage where they'd be sick enough to become a statistic.
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big business has a long history of denying and covering up hazards they are well aware of. tobacco is a great example, second hand smoke:)
I have a friend with somewhat retarded kids, that had high lead levels when young, from their old lead based painted home.
Its sad the kids are nearly grown but will never be normal. Lead DEFINETELY CAUSES RETARDATION in low levels.
No ddoubt one day workers in moon suits will be removing treated wood and contaminated soil at great expense.
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JoeSpareBedroom wrote:

Wrong question. It should be...
In order to show that health problems were caused by arsenic due to exposure to or contact with *PT LUMBER*, WHAT WOULD NEED TO HAPPEN? .
--

dadiOH
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That's reasonable.
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when in doubt about something that may endager children and cause life long troubles better safe than sorry
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JoeSpareBedroom wrote:

I'm not insisting on anything other than pointing out that if there were widespread health problems induced by use of CCA, there should be a world of evidence. That evidence would be widespread reports of problems which had as their underlying commonality some identified connection to CCA usage. I have looked; can't find it. Can you?
I repeat--we had this same discussion only a few months ago. There wasn't any evidence forthcoming then, and so far there's none now.
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There WAS data showing increased arsenic levels in certain populations of children.
There was NOT evidence showing that most kids were exhibiting advanced stages of arsenic poisoning YET - the kind that would cause the police and/or health department to begin questioning family members.
And, before some twit asks "Duh how about a controlled study?", it would be impossible to find enough parents willing to allow their kids to be used for such a study.
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JoeSpareBedroom wrote:

Reference?
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We're going in circles. I told you earlier that the information came from my kid's pediatrician. I also told you that if you wanted me to, I'd call him and see if he still had the information. Do you remember this?
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JoeSpareBedroom wrote:

Yes we are and as I have earlier said repeating a previous thread almost verbatim. Remember?
You want to add something, find some citable references and/or links. You can do that however you choose; I have no preferences/requirement.
I will also repeat yet again I spent a fair amount of time looking and came up empty. It was not, and was not intended to be, an exhaustive and scholarly literature search. However, as noted before, if the hazards of CCA were so egregious, it shouldn't take any effort at all to find a large number of citations in the readily available literature. If that were the case and I simply somehow made a bad effort, it shouldn't take someone else more than about 30 seconds to counter the argument.
--
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