Choosing a furnace

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I'm getting my furnace replaced and have some questions. How important is it for the contractor to be NATE or NADCA certified? The more expensive, big places really push these certifications. Or is this more of a sales pitch than anything?
I have 3 choices:
Bryant Plus 90t 5 year parts/labor warranty humidifier media filter duct cleaning (I need it) very well established company with all the fancy certifications and guarantees permits $4360
Bryant Plus 90t 5 year parts/2 year labor warranty humidifier media filter duct cleaning still to be added to price, probably $300-400 more very well established company with all the fancy certifications and guarantees permits $3474 (plus duct cleaning)
Rheem RGRK 10 year parts/labor humidifier media filter duct cleaning smaller company, in business for over 15 years, owner seems very competent permits $3299
Is there anything good/bad about either furnace? Comments? I know the bigger places might offer more piece of mind, but the price seems pretty steep.
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Do you want your new furnace installed by a *qualified* technician?? or by "Billy-Joe-Jim-Bob"??

You have a lot more choices than just Bryant.

I am not going to comment about brands other than to say.... check Consumer Reports.
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Noon-Air wrote:

the company has been a member of the BBB since 1980 and has no complaints in the last 3 years, the maximum reporting period. Correction: has been in business for 26 years to be exact, not 15.
My belief is that someone doesn't necessarily have to be "certified this" and "certified that" as long as they have the proper licenses, insurance, and experience to do the work. The company obviously is able to install and repair HVAC based on it's record. I'm just speculating here. Is there anything wrong with my reasoning?

You will see the 3rd one is Rheem. I also got a quote from a Lennox dealer but wasn't terribly impressed. I just don't have time to get a quote from every brand when it takes an hour each. Rheem is highly rated according to CR.

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snipped-for-privacy@yahoo.com writes:

These are all plusses.

The only thing you may be missing is any assurance on continuing education. These high efficiency furnaces have only come about in the latter half of this company's career, and are a good deal more complicated than the old stuff, and 13SEER A/C if you're doing it surely present new things to know as well. One thing the certs might potentially bring is some assurance that they are current with changes that have occurred in hte industry lately. Others can answer whether those certs actually have such continuing ed requirements.
But that said, I too am curious/dubious about the cert value. But it certainly wouldn't be a strike against someone. And frankly, if someone's name is on the business and I'm getting a 10 year warranty from them and they've been in business for 26 years, I'm worrying if they'll be around to honor that warranty, or who backs the warranty if that shop is no longer in business when I need the work? You may have this angle covered, but just wanted to toss it out there.
Best Regards, -- Todd H. http://www.toddh.net /
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Todd H. wrote: ther

The said warranty is a manufacturer's (Rheem) warranty.
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On 25 Sep 2006 18:00:20 -0700, snipped-for-privacy@yahoo.com wrote:

I like things that are high tech. So I'd go for a Carrier Infinity system, like: http://www.residential.carrier.com / with the fancy thermostat/humidistat and web control.
Don <www.donwiss.com> (e-mail link at home page bottom).
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Don Wiss wrote:

that just goes to prove there's a sucker born every minute! You should hear the talk in private contractor groups about all the nightmarish problems these system bring with them. Do remember....those on the cutting edge (of technology) bleed alot.
As a commercial dealer, I can put in any brand I want to, and for resi its always gonna be a Rheem. I LOVE the competition putting in carriers, cuz that just means more repair work soon on the horizon.
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snipped-for-privacy@yahoo.com wrote:

Nate and Nadca equal Notagotdamnthing ................Certifications, fancy trucks, fancy uniforms....fancy assed slick talking salesmen mean nothing.....
Do your own research...talk to friends, family and coworkers....people at church .... anyhow...talk to people who have had HVAC equipment serviced and installed and find out who is reliable and honest and can do you a good job.
Make sure they do a load calc on the house...make sure they get the proper permits and inspections from the city or county.....
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Holy shit! Why are these prices so cheap? What corners are these hacks cutting to quote prices so low?
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snipped-for-privacy@yahoo.com wrote:

The big places may need to charge higher since they must employ some mediocre workers due to the volume they handle (like any large company), and add in a rework fee to begin with to cover themselves. The best and worse work is done by small family own businesses. The simpler the furnace the less risk you will encounter now and in the future regardless of the choice. Talking to few customers of the big contractors is not of much help as the installation quality can vary.
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bungalow snipped-for-privacy@yahoo.com writes:

Okay I'll bite. How does a bad furnace installation typically evidence iself?
The culture of "pay for good installation" is rich certainly, and perhaps it's justified. On the other hand, is this beingf overblown a bit? How much really can go wrong?
What are the top 10 things that folks have actually seen (or heard directly from someone who saw, no hypotheticals please) screwed up by prior installers, and the potential consequences of those screwups?
For the purpose of limiting the discussion, let's leave system sizing out of the equation because a) assume we're replacing an existing system that the owner would notice is either evenly/adequately heating or cooling the house or not, backed up by b) assume the homeowner has gotten several quotes and has reviewed them to see whether all bidders have quoted consistent sizes c) the folks doing the estimates are doing the sizing, and the actual installer is showing up with a given size unit already in the truck.
Best Regards, -- Todd H. http://www.toddh.net /
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Todd H. wrote:

First sign is when your home becomes airborn and the sound of Sirens.

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On 26 Sep 2006 00:01:49 -0500, snipped-for-privacy@toddh.net (Todd H.) wrote:

Todd, I guess you'd like fries with that? Bubba
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It won't show up until its too late.

What can go wrong with a bad doctor, or a bad mechanic, or a bad cook, or......

You want pictures??

sizing?? whats to say that your furnace was sized correctly in the first place??
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Those are fairly self explanatory. None of these folks are installing brand new HVAC systems though.

Not necessary, but hey if ya got em.... I would like the cult followers of the "good installation is more important than a brand selected" religion to give some real examples of the actual perils of a bad/rookie installation.

Nothing. Which is why b) and c) are also assumed as backups.
-- Todd H. http://www.toddh.net /
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On 26 Sep 2006 00:01:49 -0500, snipped-for-privacy@toddh.net (Todd H.) wrote:

On the AC side, in no particular order,
Leaving the orifice out of a flowrater, improperly charging the system, setting the blower speed wrong, wiring the system wrong, using the wrong amperage fuses, not installing a filter, leaving large ass gaps in sheet metal transitions, leaving ducts completely loose/unconnected, improperly adjusting a txv valve, no trap in condensate lines,installing new system and not clearing old condensate lines, tech specing correct tonnage and office gets wrong tonnage and installer puts it in anyways ie, need four tons, office gets 2 1/2 ton condenser 3 1/2 ton coil and 4 ton air handler...
On the heat side, in no particular order,
No "T" in gas line. no gasflex on gas line, manifold pressure improperly set, not converting natural gas valve to propane when required, too many elbows in flue pipe, flue pipe not installed correctly, hooking VPS hoses up in wrong place on 90% furnaces, blower motors not orientated correctly causing the supply to be the return and the return to be the supply...
These are all things I have seen.
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Those are helpful examples-Thanks Al.
Damn, some bone headed stuff in there for sure! I mean, how the hell someone gets the motor in backwards and not notice the vents sucking instead of blowing... woof. And not changing the the valving to the gas in use... shit fire that would be bad news.
-- Todd H. http://www.toddh.net /
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Todd H. wrote:

I don't know how this ranks, but I had to fix a friend's furnace when she bought a couple of years ago:
The installer had put the filter holder on the side of the furnace opposite the ducts. The filter was right up against the wall of the furnace. I had to remove the filter track and re-install it on the side where the ducts were. There were a bunch of little bits to tidy up in the process.
My guess was that it was installed by someone who'd never seen a furnace before. Since the house was only a few years old, it was the original property developer's team of "expert builders". The warranty had expired a couple of years earlier, otherwise I would have made an amusing phone call on my friend's behalf.
Mike
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LMAO...oh my. Damn, there really are stone dumbass people in every profession.
-- Todd H. http://www.toddh.net /
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As long as your writing a book on dumbasses in every profession, what is *your* profession??
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