Buzzing From Furnace Unit - HVAC

[Jonathan Western]

I had my Trane air handler stop working suddenly. Even if I turn the thermostat to fan only, I just get a loud buzzing from one of the switches inside the unit, the blower motor will not start. The fan blades do spin freely.

Here is a picture, with an arrow pointing to the component that is buzzing:

Here's a closer shot of the component:

Here is a shot from the side:

I can't see in there well enough to read the markings. Is the black plastic piece a capacitor? There is a small copper cylinder to the left of it that moves when power is applied. When I turn the power on I can easily feel the vibration through the unit as this small copper piece clicks forward. I'm trying to describe this the best I can.

This is a Trane gas furnace, 23 years old. The model number is BLU045E924B1. Thanks for any advice.

[TURTLE]

This is Turtle.

I don't know what the relay and coil is for, I have not seen them on the trane stuff in a while but do service some 30 year old Trane furnaces.

I will get some hand to come see here that know about this coil relay.

TURTLE

[~KJPRO~]

It's just an old Trane 'fan control'. As you notice there is no standard Honeywell Fan Center.

I suggest that this guy call some Competent HVAC companies to get estimates for replacement. (it would be in his best interest!)

If not, he needs to loss the Epoxy coated gas flex!!!! This is old, they require stainless steel lines now, and it's against the IMC (code) to penetrate a furnace through an unprotected knock-out!!

And just look at all the shit around the burner compartment, let me guess...it's been at least 10 yrs since the last service on this unit?

~kjpro~

[Jonathan Wepp]

I didn't know about the unprotected knockout and flex hose problems. Couldn't I just update those two things? -- or did you say to replace because of the age of the unit. It was set up that way when I bought the house but probably is overdue for a service regardless. Thanks for the response.

[TURTLE]

This is Turtle.

Yes i would get you a SS flex hose to have on it and a protection where the flex come through the furnace wall.

The ideal of replacing it would be if you lived in a cold Northern climate or in the hot southern areas. These Furnaces are gas hogs if you use them a lot but if you don't use them much they don't burn much gas. Here is the reason you would change it.

Age -- There is some concern as to reliablity in a very cold climate where you could freeze to death if it failed in the right type of time and condition. OR failure to malfuction or cause a fire. Now if you maintained it real good it might not be a concern but as i see you don't keep up with it with the white burnt powder in the burner area. You do it or You should have a service company clean it out and checked out very soon as to it working right.

Fuel cost to change it out. If you live in the northern state your getting eat up with fuel cost to operate it. If you live in the Deep south you only run it

10 or 15 days a year and fuel cost is nothing.

If your '''''' not '''''' going to keep up with it. You need to change it out for the newer models that 10 times more safety devices on it to protect from fires and malifuction to cause problems. You can get in trouble not keeping up with it. The White powder i see took alteast 5 or more years to get there and it has not been clean since then. If your going to have it serviced and kept up with it. Well you can run these old model.

TURTLE

[TURTLE]

This is Turtle.

If it was a snake it would have bitten me. I did not see a fan relay at all here and just did not see it.

TURTLE

[Stormin Mormon]

First, that is one of the most splendid photography jobs I've seen in ages.

The part that is buzzing is a "relay". Which is an electrically activated switch. It shouldn't be a dificult replacement.

Replacing the gas line shouldn't be a big deal. The furnaces I've installed, we used black iron gas pipe. Though, I'll admit I've seen a lot of stainless steel flex. As for an unprotected poke through, it may be against code, but at least your gas line isn't rubbing against the sharp sheet metal edge, there.

Noticing your furnace has two burners. It's rather low efficiency. The new units are a lot more efficient. This one oughta be repairable, to get you by for awhile and then you can replace it at a time of your convenience.

[geoman]

KJpro, The IMC code, does that apply as well with black pipe as well? Iunderstand the purpose for flex and copper, but I was wondering how the wording is.

Thanks

Rich

[geoman]

What are you saying here?

[geoman]

Turtle,

If you notice there are two wires, a yellow with black stripes and a blue with black strips, they go to the relay

However, look ever so closely, there is cardboard covers to the left of the relay, that is the switch for it and the light blue wire goes to the fan below.

The guy should have taken a picture of the wire schematic on the door cover.

Now, if you go with a new furnace which will be sometime sooner than you think, I suggest a SEALED combustion with the combustion air coming from the outside. It seems that this furnace is located where wood working is/was performed. Wood dust is EXPLOSIVE. Make sure the returns and supplies are SEALED with the new furnace and put a GOOD 5" filter as a standard or as a pre filter to an electronic if static allows it.

Professionally, this furnace looks like hell,

[Joseph]

Jonathan,

After viewing the visuals you posted my recommendation is to have a tech look it over and bring it up to a safe operating condition. It appears that this furnace has been altered from its original factory configuration. Where is the transformer? Is it out side of the cabinet? The flex is violating code because it penetrates the furnace. The standards used today are that it be stainless pipe with the internal diameter to match the units btu ratings. This may be a local code but we never penetrate a cabinet with flex of any kind. I see electrical wiring miss routed and penetrating unprotectected knockouts and holes. The box you photographed there came with a cover to contain the electrical connections, this also violates the safety codes for electrical repair. This unit has been worked on by someone not familiar with the proper techniques or procedures for safe furnace repair. Please make sure you have an operational smoke and CO detector if you plan to continue to use this furnace. The odds are small that anything bad will happen but it does happen on a regular basis and we as techs get to see the very grave results. This is one reason the techs will say to replace the old for new as the efficiencies pay for the cost in short order and the newer units are much safer. HTH

Joseph (25+ years in HVAC/R)

[Greg O]

Seems obvious to me! Higher efficiency models have more burners! (But you knew that already didn't you!) Greg

[~KJPRO~]

So just because it 'is not close to the metal edge' means it's ok?

You freaking clueless HACK!! Get the training and money, buy a set of the current code books, read them , learn them, and follow them!

PERIOD!!

~kjpro~

[~KJPRO~]

Flex lines...

~kjpro~

[~KJPRO~]

configuration.

And *ANY* CO detector that you purchase at a 'Big Box' store is complete TRASH!!!

In order to meat the UL standards they can NOT alarm before 70 ppm at 60-90 mins.

The maximum ppm for 24 hrs is 9, and the maximum for 8 hrs is 35. Leaving you with a false sense of security when you purchase a CO detector from a regular store!!

I have seen MANY detectors not sounding an alarm when my pump type CO detector is reading harmful levels of CO in the structure. (I have a model that will alarm at 10 ppm)

Cost, expensive at first...but what is the safety of your family worth???

You pay more than this for your contents insurance!

~kjpro~

[geoman]

That's what I thought I read, but I wanted to give him the benefit of the doubt..... Oh well, we all have to learn sometime.

Rich

[geoman]

Thanks KJ, I was wondering if I had to go back on one installed last month :-)

[geoman]

Wow, I've always known that the tolerances are way to low for them, but to be honest I didn't know there were more sensitive units for residential usage. Do you have a recommendation KJ for us?

I use to run into a LOT of CO problems in homes but haven't lately in the last year, not one single incident.

I agree with you, I don't even understand how the EPA can allow such high levels of CO in a factory environment to be permitted knowing that CO accumulates in the body over time. Factory workers being exposed to this poison have to be affected in some way.

Rich

[~KJPRO~]

Just looked up the specific code, it says 'Semirigid metallic tubing '

I'll send you the IFGC numbers.

~kjpro~

I always use Black Iron Pipe.

[~KJPRO~]

Info is being sent to you by e-mail.

Only HVAC companies can purchase them anyway.

~kjpro~