Auxiliary water-heater tank? ? ?

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Recently I read somewhere that it's possible to add an auxiliary tank to supply water heaters.
The purpose is, water comes from underground into a storage tank, where the temperature of the water is raised by ordinary basement temperatures -- especially in furnace rooms.
This water then feeds water into the heating tank at a considerably higher temperature, thereby saving energy costs.
This is common sense. Is this technology available now?
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Recently I read somewhere that it's possible to add an auxiliary tank to supply water heaters.
The purpose is, water comes from underground into a storage tank, where the temperature of the water is raised by ordinary basement temperatures -- especially in furnace rooms.
This water then feeds water into the heating tank at a considerably higher temperature, thereby saving energy costs.
This is common sense. Is this technology available now?
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On 12/22/2009 09:39 AM, Ray wrote:

Any uninsulated tank would do this. This technology was available in 1850.
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Recently I read somewhere that it's possible to add an auxiliary tank to supply water heaters.
The purpose is, water comes from underground into a storage tank, where the temperature of the water is raised by ordinary basement temperatures -- especially in furnace rooms.
This water then feeds water into the heating tank at a considerably higher temperature, thereby saving energy costs.
This is common sense. Is this technology available now?
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On Tue, 22 Dec 2009 09:39:21 -0500, "Ray"

It's called a tempering tank.
It doesn't make quite as much sense as it appears in most cases.
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On Dec 22, 9:49�am, snipped-for-privacy@dog.com wrote:

any uninsulated tank will do this, but you wouldnt gain much. it will use the heat of your basement, so you have to heat the space more.
so whats the OPs situation?
hot water not hot enough? having a tankless issue with incoming too cold water? you want endless hot water? or some other more obscure problem?
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On Tue, 22 Dec 2009 07:01:34 -0800 (PST), " snipped-for-privacy@aol.com"

He said he's interested in "saving energy costs"
It will help cool the house very slightly in the summer, but not by much. If his heating plant is in an outbuilding that is otherwise unoccupied, there may be a little energy cost savings, but I doubt it would offset the installation of the tank.
Solar hot water coils on the roof would be a better place to spend that money. A tempering tank linked to them might make a little sense.
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How bout if the tank is buried?
Ackshooly, two tanks:
One buried, in the winter, the other exposed in the house someplace, with a fan perhaps, in the summer.
The Qs are: What is the likely temp differential in both cases, resulting in how much $$ savings, and what will the payback period be? And, initial costs? Proly not cheap. Sheeit, crappy make-up tanks for compressed air are not cheap, and it don't get much simpler than THAT!
I suspect the payback period will be substantial.
Intuitively, I agree with the statement that $$ spent on solar heating are much better spent $$ -- and likely mostly DIY, at that -- poss. ALL diy.
But, I think the premise, at least, of the OPs suggestion is good, if not the practicality/economics.
--
EA



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On Dec 22, 8:49am, snipped-for-privacy@dog.com wrote:

It does make alot of sense --- but mostly if you also heat your house with a wood burning stove as I do... My old electric 40 gal. water heater finally went belly up after about 20 years of service. I could have spent some time and money to fix it but I had been planning to try a tempering tank system for quite some time. This seemed to be the time to try it. I did all the work myself so I saved a bunch on installation cost. I installed a new 40 gal electric water heater and stripped the old heater of insulation and wiring and piped it in ahead of the new water heater. I set it right next to my wood burning stove and put a recirc loop around the top of the stove and smoke stack pipe using the top and bottom element ports of the tempering water tank. It does take awhile of good steady heating of the wood stove to get the temp of the water up in the tempering tank. But by just feeling the copper pipe of the incoming cold water to the tempering tank -- roughly 55 degrees F. -- and the pipe of the tempered water going to the new water heater -- roughly 110 to 120 degrees F.-- we get enough benefit to get a couple loads of clothes washed and a shower or two each morning before the tempered water cools appreciably. I figure we save approximately 150+ kwh / month or about $15+ / month on electricity (6 - 7 months of wood heating in our northern climate). Payback time of approximately a year for materials not counting the cost of the new heater which I needed anyway.. Steve
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wrote:

The heat that goes into the tempering tank is heat that does not go into the living space. There is no such thing as perpetual motion.
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On Dec 23, 5:21am, snipped-for-privacy@dog.com wrote:

In my case, I have alot of wood heat in the basement area of the tempering tank to spare... I don't notice that I use any more wood now than I used before the tempering tank. My basement area is certainly not any cooler. If I do use any more wood than before, it is insignificant.
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wrote:

That doesn't strike me as a very scientific or precise evaluation, especially since your claim is that you have achieved something akin to perpetual motion or cold fusion.
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On Dec 23, 11:25am, snipped-for-privacy@dog.com wrote:

I suppose I could have really detailed alot of thermodynamic b.s. and made it look more scientific or precise. I guess I'm happy with it and that's all that really counts.
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wrote:

As long as you are happy.
I absolutely love my anti-gravity machine, too.
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On Dec 23, 1:04pm, snipped-for-privacy@dog.com wrote:

I agree with the thrust of your argument. There is no free lunch. However he did say that he wrapped pipe around the stack from the wood stove. If so, and depending on how it's done, he's likely recovering some heat that would have gone wasted up the stack and outside. However the part of the heat capturing pipe above the stove is most definitely taking heat that otherwise would have heated the house. So, some of the heat going into the tank is heat that is otherwise wasted. The rest just results in having to burn more wood to achieve the same house temp, meaning he's substituted one fuel for another, which could be a good thing too, depending on the relative costs.
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On Dec 23, 2:15pm, snipped-for-privacy@optonline.net wrote:

I don't know about any free lunch but the wood I burn is of no extra cost to me exept for the time and fuel it takes me to cut it. I suppose anyone who has to buy their wood might end up costing them a bit more in the end..
I don't mean to say this is a good proposition for everyone but it works well for me.
Did I mention that I also have a "time machine?"
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A friend heated his home with wood. I asked how many hours a year it took to cut, haul, split, stack etc.......
if he worked at a minimum wage job it would have been more cost effective, and more convenient. everyones mileage may vary, but its interesting.
this friend normally heated with oil.
wood actually cost more
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I know alot of people would never go to the trouble I do of cutting, splitting, hauling, piling, storing, etc. wood that I do. But the fact is that I also enjoy doing it and the benefit is getting great exercise all year long along with the soothing steady heat that wood burning heat gives to a house. Of course you have to keep feeding the wood burning stove regularly but then it makes you get off the Lazyboy every couple hours or so.... I actually feel lucky to be able to heat my house comfortably with a wood burning stove (oil heat as needed)..
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congrats whatever floats you boat:) I was just pointing out its not really free heat
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On 12/22/2009 09:39 AM, Ray wrote:

Its called a solar hot water system. You CAN use it to preheat the water before it goes into your electric. On sunny days it would cost little electricity to heat water. On cloudy days it would preheat.
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